Issue Regarding Forum/Moderators Thread (topic renamed)

[Elizabeth]

In an effort to find a middle ground of keeping the fighting off the boards and still let people speak their minds, all threads that have become negatively-centered are moved to here. Feel free to discuss any issues you have with other members in here. Please be respectful at all times and please no name calling.

If you are not interested in negative topics, it's best just not to come in.

(Note: In order to merge threads under this one, I had to use a previous thread of mine that is no longer applicable. I didn't edit any of the posts below me but if the owners of the posts want to delete them they can. Threads merge in the order created so it's hard to create new topics and merge older threads under them.)

[FranzKafka]

Geez, Elizabeth. If you just let things go and learned to ignore this stuff, it would bew a lot better. Not to be rude, but it'd be better to let these things die, instead of adding fuel to them.

[MeLuvsKingKaysar!]

Originally posted by FranzKafka
Geez, Elizabeth. If you just let things go and learned to ignore this stuff, it would bew a lot better. Not to be rude, but it'd be better to let these things die, instead of adding fuel to them.

Geez Franz you think?????? come on stop making reply to this thing. lets get it to the bottom of the page come kids help out!!@!

[FranzKafka]

I guess I don't have the mentality of a 13 year old, so I don't think the same as you bbhypocrite.

[FranzKafka]

If you didn't want people to get involved, why not deal with this privately with Elizabeth through U2U? Instead, you created a public thread.


And Marcellas' board? I've never been insulted there. I posted maybe 2 or 3 times at most, and quit posting there because of lack of interest. Are you 12?

[FranzKafka]

Insulted by what? I only registered to post about Town Hall, and quit posting once BB was over. There was no need to post over there. Housecalls is over, and I'm not a Marcellas fan. And as far as I know, I was never insulted.

But of course you would say that, everything you post is you trying to create drama. :yawn:

[tweety_kiss]

Ray,

Please don't feed into the attention of BBH. You will only get upset.

[Elizabeth]

Okay, everybody, in an effort to keep things fun and light, let me just address a few issues about myself and my participation in here.

First, I am very outspoken. Anyone who spends any time in here knows this. I have always been this way and I probably get worse the older I get.

Generally, though, I like everyone. I enjoy being part of a group and I like when the group is as opinionated as I am. It allows for stimulating and thought-provoking conversations.

Please understand that I can disagree with you and even argue with you but I'm happy to switch subjects minutes later and any discord is quickly left by the wayside.

Do I say things I shouldn't? Yeah. About every five minutes. But I'm quick to apologize if I hurt someone's feelings or make them feel badly in any way.

So for anyone I've offended or for anything I've said in the past, right now or may say in the future that may be deemed hurtful or offensive, I apologize.

If you have any problems with me or I've made you feel unwelcomed here, please just U2U me and I'm happy to address it. :)

Elizabeth

[bigbrofan20657]

I WILL NEVER FORGIVE how nice you have been to me. :D

[bambiangel]

your forgiven *ducks for cover* but what a minute I thing you are okie dokie !very cool Elizabeth!

[FranzKafka]

Originally posted by Elizabeth

If you have any problems with me or I've made you feel unwelcomed here, please just U2U me and I'm happy to address it. :)

Elizabeth

That's a great idea. I think one of the main reasons you feel the need to post this thread is because a lot of things that could have been handled with a U2U were instead posted in the middle of a thread for all to see.

[lostincanada]

lol this was fairly unneccesary.. before u take that offensivley.. i think sometimes (esp on the net) people take things the wrong way... mainly becuase you cannot tell the tone of voice... and to just apologize is silly... im a big believer in the fact that if your going to say I'm Sorry you better mean it (fight with my boyfriend all the time cause he uses the words even when he doesnt know why im upset lol) and alot of time you dont need to apologize just explain where ur words were coming from... that being said


this was a nice idea... very big of you elizabeth...

[lostinks]

:)...What have I missed?

I don't enter all threads, so I take it I missed it. Oh well, no matter. I'm :cool:..

[RhyanShae]

What I like about U2U and PM like systems is the fact that it keeps thing out of the board, so we don't get bandwagons forming for things that are none of the majority's business.

[lavonne]

I think emotions are heated across the board, Elizabeth. You are well respected here and a vital part of what makes this forum fun!

With that said, I hope you do not change your MO here, I appreciate a little debate here and there.

[Elizabeth]

From yesterday's "discussion" it became clear that some people, not the regular members, but mostly ones who post here intermittently or are content with lurking, have formed an opinion of me that I believe has elements of the truth, but is a bit distorted.

It's just easier to clarify things and make a general apology just to clear the air. I've found apologies, whether necessary or not, go a long way.

And with this personality, I've had plenty of practice making them. ;)

Oh, and just for the record, it's also to state that I'm not going to change who I am. :)

[RhyanShae]

No one should have to change who they are. However, there should be an iota of respect for every member given by every member, and "fights" off the public board and into the private arena. Pure and simple.

For one, it keeps the threads clean. Two, people feel a hell of a lot more comfortable posting if they don't have to read them.

I keep feeling like I'm repeating myself here on the board. I've said the stuff in my post here too many times for comfort.

[Debookwrm]

Originally posted by Elizabeth
From yesterday's "discussion" it became clear that some people, not the regular members, but mostly ones who post here intermittently or are content with lurking, have formed an opinion of me that I believe has elements of the truth, but is a bit distorted.

It's just easier to clarify things and make a general apology just to clear the air. I've found apologies, whether necessary or not, go a long way.

And with this personality, I've had plenty of practice making them. ;)

Oh, and just for the record, it's also to state that I'm not going to change who I am. :)

I would prefer you to be entirely yourself here. It should be safe. I like you the way you are. I'm also someone who if they see something they don't like or are offended by, just skips it. Usually. :) Be yourself. If you start being a sugar cube and it's against your nature, your laptop will blow up because you will be pounding the keys and gritting your teeth instead of typing gently.

Deb

[Jenn]

I'm going to take a minute from the elizabeth ass-kissing session to say it's great that you love who you are, you don't want to change, and several people don't want you to change. But the bottom line is that you are a divisive figure on this board. I saw it BEFORE you came a moderator, and it's become worse even AFTER.

I don't think anyone would care if you were outspoken, or had differences of opinion, but these qualities are affecting your 'job' as moderator. It's not affecting your job BECAUSE you have differences of opinion, but because you have named yourself judge and jury for every 'regular' poster and 'lurker', you have it clear in your mind who are the 'troublemakers' (and of course, you are not one them LOL), and you act on such biases, whether wrong or right. By clearly making a distinction that 'regulars' are to be favored, you are making this place very unwelcoming for newbies. I don't think that is what Kaysar wants.

Melly and Lane are both great moderators because they rarely, if ever, take sides, make judgements about posters based on something asinine like their post count (some people have jobs, you know!), or promote themselves the way you do. I'm sure you are a great person - but that doesn't automatically make you a good moderator. A moderator is supposed to mediate disputes, not be at the center of them, or in many cases - the instigator of them.

When you say this: "I've found apologies, whether necessary or not, go a long way." - I find your apology to be insincere. You are pretty much saying that you think it wasn't necessary - but you're just doing it to 'be the bigger person'. If you this were true - you wouldn't have to point it out.

Before anyone gets on my case about not handling this through U2U - I don't 'do' U2U for stuff like this. Messages have a way of becoming forwarded and altered in situations like these.


*puts on flame retardent suit*http://www2.dupont.com/Personal_Protection/en_US/assets/application/images/en/productsServices/products/ThermoPro.jpg

[Debookwrm]

Originally posted by Jenn
I'm going to take a minute from the elizabeth ass-kissing session to say it's great that you love who you are, you don't want to change, and several people don't want you to change. But the bottom line is that you are a divisive figure on this board. I saw it BEFORE you came a moderator, and it's become worse even AFTER.

I don't think anyone would care if you were outspoken, or had differences of opinion, but these qualities are affecting your 'job' as moderator. It's not affecting your job BECAUSE you have differences of opinion, but because you have named yourself judge and jury for every 'regular' poster and 'lurker', you have it clear in your mind who are the 'troublemakers' (and of course, you are not one them LOL), and you act on such biases, whether wrong or right. By clearly making a distinction that 'regulars' are to be favored, you are making this place very unwelcoming for newbies. I don't think that is what Kaysar wants.

Melly and Lane are both great moderators because they rarely, if ever, take sides, make judgements about posters based on something asinine like their post count (some people have jobs, you know!), or promote themselves the way you do. I'm sure you are a great person - but that doesn't automatically make you a good moderator. A moderator is supposed to mediate disputes, not be at the center of them, or in many cases - the instigator of them.

When you say this: "I've found apologies, whether necessary or not, go a long way." - I find your apology to be insincere. You are pretty much saying that you think it wasn't necessary - but you're just doing it to 'be the bigger person'. If you this were true - you wouldn't have to point it out.

Before anyone gets on my case about not handling this through U2U - I don't 'do' U2U for stuff like this. Messages have a way of becoming forwarded and altered in situations like these.


*puts on flame retardent suit*http://www2.dupont.com/Personal_Protection/en_US/assets/application/images/en/productsServices/products/ThermoPro.jpg

I may appear obsequious when I am actually sincere…as are you apparently. However, I am not argumentative normally. I try to be gracious and kind. That does not make me an a$$ki$$er.

Deb

[realitymom]

I really hesitate to post this because I don't necessarily want to get blasted for my opinion as well as I simply don't have the energy to debate the issue into the ground via a U2U. But, I find myself posting, so I guess my post is meant to be. (God help me....hope I don't need one of those flame retardant suits, too :( !!) Anyway... I just have to say, I agree with some of Jenn's points...mainly about insincere sounding apologies. When an apology is made (by anyone, not just by Elizabeth) for things said ...past, present, and future..., it just loses something for me. I don't post that much either, but I do read the boards regularly, so I hope that doesn't make me any less of a fan. Again, just my opinion for what it's worth. Oh boy, I'm almost afraid to click on the "post reply" button, but here goes nothin'.... cringe

[Debookwrm]

Originally posted by realitymom
I really hesitate to post this because I don't necessarily want to get blasted for my opinion as well as I simply don't have the energy to debate the issue into the ground via a U2U. But, I find myself posting, so I guess my post is meant to be. (God help me....hope I don't need one of those flame retardant suits, too :( !!) Anyway... I just have to say, I agree with some of Jenn's points...mainly about insincere sounding apologies. When an apology is made (by anyone, not just by Elizabeth) for things said ...past, present, and future..., it just loses something for me. I don't post that much either, but I do read the boards regularly, so I hope that doesn't make me any less of a fan. Again, just my opinion for what it's worth. Oh boy, I'm almost afraid to click on the "post reply" button, but here goes nothin'.... cringe

If you think you need a flame retardent suit for me, you're mistaken. I wasn't arguing her right to an opinion...or yours for that matter. I just don't wish to be interpreted as an a$$ki$$er simply because I like someone who is strong willed.

Deb

[blueeyesdebbie22]

I am very confused, did something happen here yesterday and I missed it? I truly thought we all were getting along good

[Debookwrm]

Originally posted by blueeyesdebbie22
I am very confused, did something happen here yesterday and I missed it? I truly thought we all were getting along good

Apparently I missed it too. But it doesn't change my opinion. :)

Deb

[JLittmann]

I agree with some of Jenn's points too. I think it was a passive-aggressive apology, but I also think no apology would be needed were this poster not a mod.

I love Elizabeth as a poster; I love her creativity and her intellect, but I think she might be too emotionally invested in the board, or for/against certain posters, to be an objective and disinterested mod.

I realize this marks me as a troublemaker, but so be it.

[realitymom]

Hi Deb,

Actually, I wasn't referring to your post in any way. (To be honest, I didn't even really understand what you meant in your post, so I didn't give it much thought.) Just was referring to what Jenn wrote, that's all.

[Jenn]

I just don't wish to be interpreted as an a$$ki$$er simply because I like someone who is strong willed.


Well - deb - I apologize for any comments made in the past, present or future. That way - if I say something offensive in the future - it's OK because I've already apologized for it. And my apology is equally as sincere as Elizabeths. Really.

[blueeyesdebbie22]

Originally posted by JLittmann
I agree with some of Jenn's points too. I think it was a passive-aggressive apology, but I also think no apology would be needed were this poster not a mod.

I love Elizabeth as a poster; I love her creativity and her intellect, but I think she might be too emotionally invested in the board, or for/against certain posters, to be an objective and disinterested mod.

I realize this marks me as a troublemaker, but so be it.


No way are you a trouble maker I love ya :):):)

[JLittmann]

Originally posted by blueeyesdebbie22



No way are you a trouble maker I love ya :):):)

:D But it's already on my business card! I'm totally more trouble than a barrel full of your avatars.

[blueeyesdebbie22]

Originally posted by JLittmann
Originally posted by blueeyesdebbie22



No way are you a trouble maker I love ya :):):)

:D But it's already on my business card! I'm totally more trouble than a barrel full of your avatars.

:D:D:D:D:D:D

[RhyanShae]

What cracks me up is from the start of getting moderators, people have questioned Elizabeth's choosing. Lane and Melly weren't questioned whatsoever.

They have a quieter moderation style. They're doing the same stuff (from what I see when they do mention it), physically on the board that Elizabeth is. Yet, everyone is paranoid that Elizabeth will censor.

She was made mod. By Kaysar. If you don't think she should be mod, that's fine. But, she was made it by Kaysar because he thought she should. All three moderators are vastly different in their posting style. All three have managed to stand out to him and show him they're responsible and able to do the job. And, I think, Kaysar knows what he wants in mind from the board and Kaysar will do what he can to direct it and make it that way. Whether that means keeping the moderators or not.

I'm getting sick of these posts where people have a disagreement, let it get to a high point on the board, and instead of being respectful to the others who simply don't want to read it, NOT taking it off the board. IT's not just about Elizabeth. It's about other fights. Other discussions. Elizabeth isn't at the core of all the disagreement. Do I agree with what she did in the Howie Myspace thread? No, but then, I don't agree with the small little fiasco it became on the board.

Take fights and disagreements off the board. That entire issue could have been handled in a U2U. No one should have had to see it. But, if not jumping on the bashing Elizabeth bandwagon is being an asskisser, then sign me up on the list then. The logic is astounding.

[canadaloveskaysar]

lol what a joke this Thread is,

[Maxie]

Originally posted by Elizabeth
From yesterday's "discussion" it became clear that some people, not the regular members, but mostly ones who post here intermittently or are content with lurking, have formed an opinion of me that I believe has elements of the truth, but is a bit distorted.

It's just easier to clarify things and make a general apology just to clear the air. I've found apologies, whether necessary or not, go a long way.

And with this personality, I've had plenty of practice making them. ;)

Oh, and just for the record, it's also to state that I'm not going to change who I am. :)

Sincere apologies go along way ones to make yourself look better don't. It really bothers me the way you act towards the ones that don't posts at a rate you find acceptable. This doesn't clear up anything it just makes it more apparent that you feel you can walk all over anyone you want.

[Jenn]

Yet, everyone is paranoid that Elizabeth will censor.

I don't think anyone is paranoid about that. I've already stated why I don't think she is a good moderator, and that wasn't it. Don't put words in my mouth.


She was made mod. By Kaysar. If you don't think she should be mod, that's fine. But, she was made it by Kaysar because he thought she should.

And if kaysar doesn't like the fact that I disagree with his choice - he can ban me, or whatever it is he wants to do.

[jerrij]

Originally posted by Jenn
I'm going to take a minute from the elizabeth ass-kissing session to say it's great that you love who you are, you don't want to change, and several people don't want you to change. But the bottom line is that you are a divisive figure on this board. I saw it BEFORE you came a moderator, and it's become worse even AFTER.

I don't think anyone would care if you were outspoken, or had differences of opinion, but these qualities are affecting your 'job' as moderator. It's not affecting your job BECAUSE you have differences of opinion, but because you have named yourself judge and jury for every 'regular' poster and 'lurker', you have it clear in your mind who are the 'troublemakers' (and of course, you are not one them LOL), and you act on such biases, whether wrong or right. By clearly making a distinction that 'regulars' are to be favored, you are making this place very unwelcoming for newbies. I don't think that is what Kaysar wants.

Melly and Lane are both great moderators because they rarely, if ever, take sides, make judgements about posters based on something asinine like their post count (some people have jobs, you know!), or promote themselves the way you do. I'm sure you are a great person - but that doesn't automatically make you a good moderator. A moderator is supposed to mediate disputes, not be at the center of them, or in many cases - the instigator of them.

When you say this: "I've found apologies, whether necessary or not, go a long way." - I find your apology to be insincere. You are pretty much saying that you think it wasn't necessary - but you're just doing it to 'be the bigger person'. If you this were true - you wouldn't have to point it out.

Before anyone gets on my case about not handling this through U2U - I don't 'do' U2U for stuff like this. Messages have a way of becoming forwarded and altered in situations like these.


*puts on flame retardent suit*http://www2.dupont.com/Personal_Protection/en_US/assets/application/images/en/productsServices/products/ThermoPro.jpg

I am with Jenn on this one.

What happened the other day was the worse case of moderating I have ever seen and if it keeps up Kaysar won't have a board.

[RhyanShae]

I wasn't putting words in your mouth. I was addressing some of your issues and some issues others have brought up. I also am addressing some of the issues that came about in the "we need a moderator" discussions in which, if I recall correctly, many people were worried about censorship, and moderators getting power hungry and having an ill-effect on the board.

My thoughts are that as a moderator, she has to put a face to the board as to what kind of posts are acceptable. I never agreed with her calling someone out in a thread like she did, but I also will never agree to someone censoring themselves on a board to make people happy. No one here should have to. There should be respect for all.

I don't think you should have to have a post count goal to make yourself a good member. During those moderator discussions, I probably had 20 posts. I have more now. Why? Because about two weeks ago, the discussion became a little more into something that would draw me out. Threads like the abortion thread, about politics, about bringing some more thought into posts are the things I want. I don't disagree with Elizabeth trying to urge posts towards that arena.

She wasn't calling the posts trivial, but the subjects. And, trvial is one of those words that people take as an insult, and I understand it. There are some posts just made for the fact that it'll increase their post count and attract Kaysar's attention for the pure number.

Being a regular is in how you participate. Are you participating in discussions? When your name shows up on Who's Online, do people recognize you and can associate you with certain posts? I don't expect people to answer these questions. It's just how I've noticed regular is being used here. It's not post count. It's presence.



And, the moment Kaysar decides to ban people for disagreeing with him, then, yes, this became a censorship board, and the man would no longer have my respect. Being that I don't see him as such, I think people should take their moderator concerns to HIM and to the MOD in question, and see it resolved in that way.

[canadaloveskaysar]

Kaysar,

I think your board is getting a lil out of control. I thought that getting Mods would help but I see it hasnt. Kaysar you helped me look at life differently and helped me see that you cant always read a book by its cover. I will now ALWAYS remember you for what you have taught me. I think Im going to take some time away from this board as I see no need in reading a ton of posts about the same old BS.

Too all my New friends I made here I will be back one day too see if anything has changed...I hope it does...Until then I will see you on other boards take care...

Amy

[lostinks]

Wow. People keep leaving. I don't get it. What do they want? :) Isn't this suppose to be a fun board? Where if you want to talk about crap you can or if you want to talk politics you can. Heck you all talked about abortions yesterday. Don't get it, unless you want Kaysar to come on to chat.? ;)

[Maxie]

It's not the mods it's one mod.

[-diana-]

How is it getting out of control still?

But sad to see you go.

[Ashlaefedorov]

I know it's one Mod and it's NOT Lane!

[Maxie]

Originally posted by Ashlaefedorov
I know it's one Mod and it's NOT Lane!

No it's not Lane Kaysar made a good choice when he picked her.

[JLittmann]

It's a great board. Informative, fun, interesting - well worth a mimimal and expected amount of normal drama. I'm sure this will all work itself out.

[lostinks]

I don't see the fighting, the drama. I don't get it. Really. I am starting to feel like I may be visiting a different board than everyone else. :). But then again, I don't go into every thread.

[bigbrofan20657]

It's not the mods it's one mod.

Elizabeth posted this last night....

Okay, everybody, in an effort to keep things fun and light, let me just address a few issues about myself and my participation in here.

First, I am very outspoken. Anyone who spends any time in here knows this. I have always been this way and I probably get worse the older I get.

Generally, though, I like everyone. I enjoy being part of a group and I like when the group is as opinionated as I am. It allows for stimulating and thought-provoking conversations.

Please understand that I can disagree with you and even argue with you but I'm happy to switch subjects minutes later and any discord is quickly left by the wayside.

Do I say things I shouldn't? Yeah. About every five minutes. But I'm quick to apologize if I hurt someone's feelings or make them feel badly in any way.

So for anyone I've offended or for anything I've said in the past, right now or may say in the future that may be deemed hurtful or offensive, I apologize.

If you have any problems with me or I've made you feel unwelcomed here, please just U2U me and I'm happy to address it.

Elizabeth

You got a problem u2u her. otherwise stop the complaining.

[JLittmann]

Well, that's good idea, except telling people to U2U it after it's been brought up so publicly is a form of silencing. Not in any huge Orwellian way, just a run of the mill rhetorical tactic to keep the addressing of forum problems in select hands.

As Jenn has noted too, there is no protection against u2us being changed except constant screen capturing. That would not protect against them being passed along, either. Public posting seem to best remedy available at this time, particularly since a public discussion was already instigated by the apology.

[RhyanShae]

I think he's remarking upon the fact that it's not remaining simply in that one thread, but has been stated now in at least two others since I logged on this afternoon.

And, if you're really concerned with U2U's being changed, you can save a copy of your U2U or send one to Kaysar or someone else alongside when you send it to the original poster. Send it to all three moderators.

[Taelyn]

Since its too early for popcorn (and I had plenty at the movies last night) I grab some coffee and my toast .. and sit back with a chuckle.. while I await Y&R.
**Looks around for melly**
you got the donuts ????

[JLittmann]

Originally posted by RhyanShae
I think he's remarking upon the fact that it's not remaining simply in that one thread, but has been stated now in at least two others since I logged on this afternoon.

And, if you're really concerned with U2U's being changed, you can save a copy of your U2U or send one to Kaysar or someone else alongside when you send it to the original poster. Send it to all three moderators.

That's a good point about it moving threads. I think we should streamline it too. I take the point about the u2u's also - I usually save a screen capture - but if forwarding is needed then the inital longing for privacy has been negated.

I guess my point is that if we thought this should be a private matter, I don't understand the public address to begin with - it just feels like the public soapbox is only ideally available for one person if everyone is supposed to move to private messages after one person has spoken, if you see what I mean.

So, I think you're right about the U2U's, at the end of the day. For everyone, though, not just lurkers or irregulars.

[RhyanShae]

That's a good point about it moving threads. I think we should streamline it too. I take the point about the u2u's also - I usually save a screen capture - but if forwarding is needed then the inital longing for privacy has been negated.

Right, but I guess it's still more private than making the entire board watch it. Especially when it is jumping from thread to thread in people's references and remarks. I really wouldn't care as much, I guess, of it being on the board if the disagreement started in a thread and remained in the thread. My problem is whether said jokingly or not, when you refer to it in a thread where it has nothing to do with the original subject, you sound like you're holding a grudge and it's snide. It does nothing to further any discussion, and instead, deviates from the original post. When it happened in the abortion thread last night, it irritated me, but I moved past it and tried to return the topic to the original place it had been before it.

I guess my point is that if we thought this should be a private matter, I don't understand the public address to begin with - it just feels like the public soapbox is only ideally available for one person if everyone is supposed to move to private messages after one person has spoken, if you see what I mean.

Well, I think it should move to a private matter when the discussion starts getting into more personal realms. If you're just disagreeing with the opinion the person's presenting, and not their personality, it's okay to have it on the board. In fact, that's a good discussion/debate as it's the opinion/arguments being attacked, so to speak, and not the person. The moment it goes into, "you're such a *****!" attitudes, and attacks on the person, take it off the board or don't go there.

So, I think you're right about the U2U's, at the end of the day. For everyone, though, not just lurkers or irregulars.

Oh, totally. Lurkers are members to. A lot of people seem to be taking offense at the "regular" comments some (including Elizabeth) are making in regards to it. It's not about post count. It's about being active in discussion and actively making the board a more lively, interesting community. If all you're doing is reading, then you're a member, and no, not less important, but not an active member. I know. I was a lurker for a long time.

[Debookwrm]

I didn't mean to offend anyone with what I said. I was only commenting on point in Jenn's post. Absolutely everyone should have their own opinions. It's a free country...so far.

I think Melly, Lane and Elizabeth provide a nice balance. Melly is consistantly funny and irreverant. Lane is quieter and just by being in the room (sic) seems to calm. Elizabeth stirs up more things, simply because she challenges the norm. Together they are a great balance.

Deb

[JLittmann]

Well, I think it should move to a private matter when the discussion starts getting into more personal realms. If you're just disagreeing with the opinion the person's presenting, and not their personality, it's okay to have it on the board. In fact, that's a good discussion/debate as it's the opinion/arguments being attacked, so to speak, and not the person. The moment it goes into, "you're such a [Censored]!" attitudes, and attacks on the person, take it off the board or don't go there.

We are in agreement there, then. I feel like the majority of the discussion on the apology thread was differences of opinion, with a few moments that could have been resolved privately.

As to why it keeps jumping up in threads, off-topic, well, I'm guessing there are enough people upset about things that it is not going to die down without some resolution, some time, or some exodus.

I have faith it be will be resolved soon, though, if only because we'll have Kaysar to talk about today after he's on Y&R!

[bigbrofan20657]

sheesh, some people cant even take an apology with out complaining.

I believe that Elizabeth was making a sincere effort to bury the hatchet, so why sit here and tear that apology apart? I am just as strong willed as Elizabeth so I can say this for a fact. People who have strong wills or opinions, find it harder to apologize. So when they do, it is meant.

[RhyanShae]

I haven't watched Y&R in so many years, and it shocks me how many characters I don't recognize. hehe. I wasn't really paying attention at first when he came on. Bad me.

I agree. People are upset, and they're carrying it through threads because they're upset. But, doing so really doesn't help the atmosphere of the board. Three quarters of the time I come here, whether to just read or actually post, I see people getting along and having fun. We managed it last night, even after Elizabeth's thread went up. People can and have managed to resolve things. As I've said, I just don't think dragging the rest of the board which for the particular discussion may have nothing to do with it, is wrong.

The mudslinging, though, has to go. I don't think anyone wants it here.

[Jenn]

and moderators getting power hungry and having an ill-effect on the board.


And you don't think that's happened? I do. And I'm not alone, that's for sure. And as far as censorship is concerned - I'm not worried about Elizabeth censoring our posts because I don't think she's that stupid. But, people ARE censoring THEMSELVES because of her.

And, the moment Kaysar decides to ban people for disagreeing with him, then, yes, this became a censorship board, and the man would no longer have my respect.

For the record - I do not think Kaysar WOULD ban somebody for disagreeing with his choice of moderator. I said that because I've seen that tactic here before. many times when elizabeth tries to justify her actions, her attitude and her responses are always along the lines of "I'm gonna do what I'm gonna do and if Kaysar wants it to change, he will take care of it". IMO, she's trying to invoke the name of kaysar in order to placate the masses. We've seen other people use that technique - but the name was "cappy". It worked then - and it pretty much works now, here - ironically.

[jerrij]

Oh, and just for the record, it's also to state that I'm not going to change who I am.


Elizabeth no one expects you to change who you are but if you continue to moderate the way you do things aren't going to get any better.

[RhyanShae]

And you don't think that's happened? I do. And I'm not alone, that's for sure. And as far as censorship is concerned - I'm not worried about Elizabeth censoring our posts because I don't think she's that stupid. But, people ARE censoring THEMSELVES because of her.


And, I censor my true opinions on things because of the board in general. We make the choice whether or not we're going to post something. I choose to keep some of my opinions to myself about things because I don't want to insult people. If she doesn't care about that, nothing I say or anyone else does is going to change it.

I censored myself early on because I saw people saying and doing things I felt was inappropriate and not of their place. I also knew it would be a matter of being jumped on and screamed out that I'm not truly a fan because I don't think it was any of my business.

I just think it's a little exaggeration to say Elizabeth is the sole reason people aren't posting, as I see new members, and more members speaking up more and more, posting more and more. Heck, I'm one of them. I just started posting more when I saw discussion I preferred to participate in. And, evidently those she's had a conflict with are still posting, and pretty regularly, so I don't see a massive problem here.

[STella668]

I'm a moderator on a board that can get rather contentious now and then, and I do NOT feel that a moderator's role is always to tiptoe around the edge of conflict, trying to keep it off the board.

Sometimes, as I see it, the job of a moderator is to pick a nice sharp scalpel, head for the biggest, reddest swelling, and jump back quick while the pus splatters.

Because I write frequently, type very fast, and have, shall we say, strong and well-defended opinions, there is frequently gossip that I think I run the site, that I need taken down a peg, that if the owner of the site knew what I was doing I'd be so in trouble.....

(How do I know this? There are always people willing to let another know what's being said about them. And when I get the same verbatim message from multiple sources, and diffing the files shows NO sign of editing, I feel fairly comfortable speculating that such emails about my awfulness are circulating. LOVE to pipe up about 'em, but I will NOT out my sources.)

Being a moderator puts a target on your a$$. Being a blunt outspoken honest person does too. People who're more comfortable with the backchannel chitchat, and its opportunities for, shall we say, creative editing (forgery, fraud, and slander are such UGLY words, you know? Give me the vapors, they do!) possibly dislike the outspoken sort, even when they're not moderators.

I have apparently missed a lot of threads on this site that I'm quite glad I did. When I see a whole mess of posts that seem to be about a group of people all calling each other poopyheads and snot-eaters, I might read a bit to see if the parties to the debate are evenly matched, and leave when I see that the one being called a snot-eating poopyhead is well able to defend herself. Or I might mumble "another fookin' stupid messageboard mud wrestle" and go on.

But one thing I am very unlikely to buy into is the idea that a moderator should be submissive to the most obnoxious venom of people who started out with the base of respect we're each entitled to by being human. The way I see it, respect is earned, after that first bit. So is contempt.

I have no personal idea whether or not Elizabeth is a snot-eating poopyhead. Haven't noticed it so far. If we meet, and desires and negotiation go that way, ass-kissing might happen. If we must, assKICKING will also happen.

But for now, I am unapologetically here to say that being a moderator can really suck, but buying into the idea that you should never be at the core of a dispute, kicking butt and taking names, clarifying the issues, and carrying on cranky, that would make it suck even harder.

Most of the time, on the board I tend, I'm a sort of janitor, taking out the trash, fixing things, explaining how to use features of the software. Sometimes, I'm a beat cop, discouraging by my presence some of the things that might otherwise happen. And once in a while, when private messages, careful negotiation public or private, and a little gentle humor have all failed, I'm in the middle of a brawl, singing obscenely cheerful battle cries and ripping off heads with glee.

I think I'm a tolerably good moderator, because that doesn't happen very often. I think I'd be a pizzPOOR moderator if, when it needs to, I could not.

(The person who selected the moderation team for this site did a great job, I think. She's got a loud rude jerk (*smiles and waves*), a person who is very much more polite and conciliatory than I am, and someone who rarely makes time to post, but when it's necessary to speak up, is just about always on point.)

So, executive summary: I have no idea what the "facts" of the kerfuffle I've been ignoring are, but I believe part of a mod's job is to be, now and then, a loud presence, and other times, it's more appropriate to pull out the soft answer that turneth away wrath. So the folks saying her high-profile style is out of place in a moderator get no support here. And I do NOT have a clue or an opinion on whatever the current rolling catfight is ostensibly about -- from way out here, it looks like it could be divergent styles looking for something to be about, but I'd have to read that topic to have an opinion, and I DON'T WANT ONE!

Another part of being a moderator is knowing when to step back and not get it ON you, and even though the only person I'm moderating on this board is me, that's precisely what I'm doing about it. Until this post, and very probably once it's sent, too.

ST*

[percarde]

Something is in the air tonight.....

http://forum.realitybbq.com/index.php?showtopic=13352&st=0

[Elizabeth]

Well, this was interesting.

Just for the record, I thought I was pretty clear about the apology...

I'm not sorry for the things I say because I stand behind them.

I am sorry if you were offended by them.

If you don't like me, that's your prerogative and you're welcome to it.

Enough said.

[Taelyn]

I think what needs to be noted here is this.

Melly, is a very very outspoken force on this board, However , Ive not seen or heard *1* negative post about her as a Moderator.

Lane, Is a strong quiet Moderator who does her job , but in a quiet and efficient manner. again not *1*negative post or comment on her Modding.

Thats to be applauded.

I've also noted a screaming silence from them in any of the more opinionated threads. Not a bad thing either, as they dont jump to defend or condem anyone.
They dont feel the need to be center of attention, or CONTROL the boards...
Its not a MODS job to Direct or steer a board, they are here to DIFFUSE, and "Moderate"


Elizabeth is a very smart, talented, outspoken,opinionated person with alot of creativity, but maybe she is a tad "TOO" outspoken. It seems to be getting her in a lot of heat here.

Maybe instead of an apology , a little self-examination and a step back is in order, perhaps learn a little from your fellow Mods and follow in their quiet unobtrusive footsteps.Stop trying to LEAD..and just BE THERE when you are called and/or needed.
Afterall, thats what you are here for.

Not to lead, but to assist.

Just my opinion
Taelyn

[blueeyesdebbie22]

Originally posted by Taelyn
I think what needs to be noted here is this.

Melly, is a very very outspoken force on this board, However , Ive not seen or heard *1* negative post about her as a Moderator.

Lane, Is a strong quiet Moderator who does her job , but in a quiet and efficient manner. again not *1*negative post or comment on her Modding.

Thats to be applauded.

I've also noted a screaming silence from them in any of the more opinionated threads. Not a bad thing either, as they dont jump to defend or condem anyone.
They dont feel the need to be center of attention, or CONTROL the boards...
Its not a MODS job to Direct or steer a board, they are here to DIFFUSE, and "Moderate"


Elizabeth is a very smart, talented, outspoken,opinionated person with alot of creativity, but maybe she is a tad "TOO" outspoken. It seems to be getting her in a lot of heat here.

Maybe instead of an apology , a little self-examination and a step back is in order, perhaps learn a little from your fellow Mods and follow in their quiet unobtrusive footsteps.Stop trying to LEAD..and just BE THERE when you are called and/or needed.
Afterall, thats what you are here for.

Not to lead, but to assist.

Just my opinion
Taelyn

I think that was very well put and I do agree with a lot that you said in that post. You were not rude or mean in any way, and you still got the point across :)

[Jenn]

What taelyn said.

[Elizabeth]

I think the mods' personalities were quiet clear before we were given the positions as mods.

I'm not going to change who I am in order to get the majority vote. I've always been a leader and truly good leaders don't work to appease the masses.

They awaken the masses.

And if my challenging people causes conflict and controversy on these boards, then it should be perceived as a good thing.

People get complacent in mediocrity. They go about their daily routines and are happy to just get along and go about their business.

When they see an anomaly to their peaceful lives in the form of me, it often upsets them bcause I tend to push people out of their comfort zone.

(Note: I'm speaking generally about my experiences in group dynamic situations that extend beyond this board.)

But for me to try to conform myself to become more like the masses would negate everything I've worked to achieve.

Which brings up a good point...maybe we should have a discussion on self-actualization and where people are on Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs.

[bambiangel]

wow I am truly in awe of the strong opinionated intelligent people in this thread but I am one of the original asskissers.. I think it really should be dropped! The way Elizabeth apologized whether you agree or not should just be left to stand and we have so many more interesting things to talk about than things that are over..oh by the you people truly do amaze me thats why i'm here...all of you so far..my birds even laugh with me especially when I repeat a post out loud ...

[Ashlaefedorov]

I think I maybe leaving as well! I haven't made descision yet but my instincts are telling me to leave! I am trying to make my mind up IF or when I leave this board you can find me at Mike's board!

[Taelyn]

Are you serious Elizabeth ???

God Im almost laughing my ass off at that.
You really are full of yourself.

How did we ever survive in our mediocre hum drum worlds before you came along?
Thank GOD we have a "Leader" like you

Are you by chance related to Cappy ????


I think Ill take my mediocre peaceful self away from this thread and anything that remotely reminds me of you, and somehow I think Ill be just fine.

[Elizabeth]

I'd just like to say that every post issued would be the same whether or not I was a moderator. I'd rather not be a moderator and be free to be myself than be a censored moderator.

When K asked me to moderate, he didn't say, "Hey, do you want to moderate and if so, could you tone down the personality?"

[Jenn]

Now, I've seen everything.

I think you missed the point Elizabeth. You are not here to be our 'leader', you are here to be a 'moderator'. If you see yourself as a 'leader' here, then it's because it was a self appointed position, and much like a dictatorship. Kaysar didn't appoint you 'leader', he appointed you 'moderator'. Please try to understand the difference.

And you are not 'challenging people', you are pissing people off because you are bossy, judgemental, and on a massive power trip.

[Ashlaefedorov]

Elizabeth you are not the reason why I am thinking about Leaving! I just wanted to tell you that OK!

[Jenn]

When K asked me to moderate, he didn't say, "Hey, do you want to moderate and if so, could you turn down the personality?"

Did I call it, or did I CALL IT? LOL

[Elizabeth]

Elizabeth you are not the reason why I am thinking about Leaving! I just wanted to tell you that OK!

Good, because I've put a great deal of effort into making this an interesting forum, even if it means alienating some people.

We can't always have discussions about hair color and what food most resembles you now can we?

[JLittmann]

Wow. I haven't seen anyone try to self-aggrandize with Maslow since senior year of high school. Well, I'm out. I did not care for Eric's ridiculous delusions of leadership; I see no reason to bother with similar delusions on a forum.

[jerrij]

Originally posted by Elizabeth
I think the mods' personalities were quiet clear before we were given the positions as mods.

I'm not going to change who I am in order to get the majority vote. I've always been a leader and truly good leaders don't work to appease the masses.

They awaken the masses.

And if my challenging people causes conflict and controversy on these boards, then it should be perceived as a good thing.

People get complacent in mediocrity. They go about their daily routines and are happy to just get along and go about their business.

When they see an anomaly to their peaceful lives in the form of me, it often upsets them bcause I tend to push people out of their comfort zone.

(Note: I'm speaking generally about my experiences in group dynamic situations that extend beyond this board.)

But for me to try to conform myself to become more like the masses would negate everything I've worked to achieve.

Which brings up a good point...maybe we should have a discussion on self-actualization and where people are on Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs.

I'm sorry I don't see how insulting people, playing favorites telling people what to do is a good thing. It's obvious Elizabeth that you are a person that only sees their side and that is about all you can comprehend. There isn't anything we can do about it here but maybe in the future you can refrain from using your tactics at other boards where you are not a mod.

Example posted at Michaels board in a thread someone started about the nerd herd.

Elizabeth

Member




--------------------------------------------------------------------------------




Posts: 152
Registered: 27-8-2005
Member Is Offline


posted on 2-10-2005 at 18:51



Don't post this on Kaysar's board. It won't be there long.

This is the crap I have a problem with.

[Elizabeth]

Please note the note:

(Note: I'm speaking generally about my experiences in group dynamic situations that extend beyond this board.)

[Taelyn]

Good, because I've put a great deal of effort into making this an interesting forum, even if it means alienating some people. We can't always have discussions about hair color and what food most resembles you now can we?


Here's some news you may not be aware of !!!
Its not you that makes this forum Interesting Elizabeth,
Its KAYSAR.

And Its members have the right to talk about whatever the hell they want.
EVEN hair color and favorite foods and whatnot.

[jerrij]

Good, because I've put a great deal of effort into making this an interesting forum, even if it means alienating some people.


Unfortunatly the ones you are alienating came here for Kaysar not you.

[kynui2]

Can't we all just get along? LOL

[JLittmann]

No one is against intellectual threads. No one is against an interesting forum. That is a strawman fallacy, and a very poor and reductive argument.

[Taelyn]

That is a strawman fallacy, and a very poor and reductive argument.

HUH ????

~laughs~
Just kidding

[Elizabeth]

I'll be back later to pick up the discussion. Right now I have a business to run.

[Jenn]

No one is against intellectual threads. No one is against an interesting forum. That is a strawman fallacy, and a very poor and reductive argument.

Exactly.

[JLittmann]

lol, sorry, I phrased that badly. The argument is being presented that some people have problems with the mod-ship because we are against intelligent threads, and that's a totally unfair and self-serving summation of the position.

It's a really neat history! Soldiers would build fake people, like scarecrows, to practise fighting on - with the idea that this is the weakest opponent imaginable. So, in debate, when someone builds a really weak and crappy argument in order to beat it, it's called a strawman.

For example, my bf insists my taste in music is horrible, which he proves because I listen to Cyndi Lauper occasionally, no matter what else I listen to. :P

[FranzKafka]

Perception is reality, Elizabeth. I'm not going to state my personal opinion on this matter, because no one cares about that but me, but the fact there are so many members who feel a certain way about you is evidence that there is a problem. Don't you think?

No need to change your personality, but perhaps accepting moderator position does require a change in your practices on the board.

[Debookwrm]

What we have here is a failure to communicate...

Sorry but it's apropos...don't you think?

[Taelyn]

I agree completely, what I have a problem with is her assumption that we are incapable of that without her "leadership".
I find that offensive and absurd.

I also see no problem with the lighthearted threads, I think they are fun and amusing in an often volotile atmosphere.

[percarde]

Originally posted by Debookwrm
What we have here is a failure to communicate...

Sorry but it's apropos...don't you think?

Is this Road Prison 36? I thought it was 38. ;)

[Debookwrm]

Originally posted by percarde
Originally posted by Debookwrm
What we have here is a failure to communicate...

Sorry but it's apropos...don't you think?

Is this Road Prison 36? I thought it was 38. ;)

Together we will march forward and change the face of this thread. Shall we begin with inane commentary on the state of television or delve deeper into the poor showing at the theaters during the summer? You pick! :D

Deb

[Maxie]

My hope is Kaysar gets an admin in here that can be around more and take care of these problems or the problem. Until then I think I am joining the ranks of those leaving for now.

[bigbrofan20657]

Yes, there is a problem here, but it is not with elizabeth. Think about it, She made an honest attempt at an apology, and people turn that into an argument. Why do that? I am here to support kaysar but as of right now Im done with this board (and its not because of elizabeth)

[Ashlaefedorov]

I am one of those who are thinkin about leaving as well! But I haven't made my final decision yet! But my mind is telling me leave!

[jerrij]

Originally posted by bigbrofan20657
Yes, there is a problem here, but it is not with elizabeth. Think about it, She made an honest attempt at an apology, and people turn that into an argument. Why do that? I am here to support kaysar but as of right now Im done with this board (and its not because of elizabeth)

I really hope you don't leave the board BigBro.

[Ashlaefedorov]

I am thinking of leaving this board myself! It isn't cause of Elizbeth either! It's because of other reasons!

[Taelyn]

Not me,
Im here for Kaysar, everything else is trivial.

[Pam2]

I have two admins. on my forums besides me.

[Jenn]

The argument is being presented that some people have problems with the mod-ship because we are against intelligent threads, and that's a totally unfair and self-serving summation of the position.


Just because it bears repeating... Maybe if she reads it enough, she might actually get it.

[jerrij]

Originally posted by Ashlaefedorov
I am thinking of leaving this board myself! It isn't cause of Elizbeth either! It's because of other reasons!

I don't think any of you shoud leave the board over this.

[Eppii]

this place is getting too tense. you guys loosen up! who cares if we talk about trivial stuff it's all in good fun. i think it's our perogative whether to be silly or get into serious topics.

[Jenn]

Think about it, She made an honest attempt at an apology, and people turn that into an argument. Why do that?

You're right. Elizabeth is a victim and everyone that stated their feelings about her 'leadership' style are just ... whatever. Bottom line is that she's an angel and the board would be lost without her.


Or..... since she is the common denominator here, maybe there is a problem.

[jerrij]

We can't always have discussions about hair color and what food most resembles you now can we?


You know I admin on a popular Clay Aiken board and I know all about silly goofy posts.Sometimes I get a little tired of them but what I want isn't important it's what the members want to talk about that counts. When you take a job as admin or mod you are there for a reason and that reason is the members, without them there wouldn't be a board.

[Sherry]

Originally posted by Jenn
I'm going to take a minute from the elizabeth ass-kissing session to say it's great that you love who you are, you don't want to change, and several people don't want you to change. But the bottom line is that you are a divisive figure on this board. I saw it BEFORE you came a moderator, and it's become worse even AFTER.

I don't think anyone would care if you were outspoken, or had differences of opinion, but these qualities are affecting your 'job' as moderator. It's not affecting your job BECAUSE you have differences of opinion, but because you have named yourself judge and jury for every 'regular' poster and 'lurker', you have it clear in your mind who are the 'troublemakers' (and of course, you are not one them LOL), and you act on such biases, whether wrong or right. By clearly making a distinction that 'regulars' are to be favored, you are making this place very unwelcoming for newbies. I don't think that is what Kaysar wants.

Melly and Lane are both great moderators because they rarely, if ever, take sides, make judgements about posters based on something asinine like their post count (some people have jobs, you know!), or promote themselves the way you do. I'm sure you are a great person - but that doesn't automatically make you a good moderator. A moderator is supposed to mediate disputes, not be at the center of them, or in many cases - the instigator of them.

When you say this: "I've found apologies, whether necessary or not, go a long way." - I find your apology to be insincere. You are pretty much saying that you think it wasn't necessary - but you're just doing it to 'be the bigger person'. If you this were true - you wouldn't have to point it out.

Before anyone gets on my case about not handling this through U2U - I don't 'do' U2U for stuff like this. Messages have a way of becoming forwarded and altered in situations like these.


*puts on flame retardent suit*http://www2.dupont.com/Personal_Protection/en_US/assets/application/images/en/productsServices/products/ThermoPro.jpg


I have to totaly agree with her on this one.

[Sherry]

Originally posted by Maxie
It's not the mods it's one mod.

Yep......

[angelbabe]

i never noticed any problems here. i thought things where going ok and theres been no fighting in the last week or two. i still like coming here and i'll keep coming here until i'm not welcome.:cool:

[Eppii]

When you take a job as admin or mod you are there for a reason and that reason is the members, without them there wouldn't be a board.


amen, jerrij.

[lavonne]

Originally posted by angelbabe
i never noticed any problems here. i thought things where going ok and theres been no fighting in the last week or two. i still like coming here and i'll keep coming here until i'm not welcome.:cool:

You been sleeping on the job again angel? You've missed a couple of doozies.

Usually when I see things getting out of control, I will make a half-a$$ attempt to make people laugh and lighten up.

Unfortunately, yesterday I lost my temper with another member of this forum. For that, I apologize. It was not my intention to make any other members feel uncomfortable.

But let me say this. When we continue to circumvent the same old discussions that happened days ago, it serves no purpose but to bring up the same emotions that brought it to a head in the first place.

Let's just put it behind us and move on...Elizabeth is making an effort, and I think the rest of us should too.

[lavonne]

btw, angel, LOVE your avatar...;)

[melly]

Originally posted by Ashlaefedorov
Elizabeth you are not the reason why I am thinking about Leaving! I just wanted to tell you that OK!

hmm...so if its not lane and its not elizabeth. i wonder who it could be??:P this is all very funny.

[IowaGal1975]

I'm here for Kaysar and Kaysar alone......I think he's a great person and I really like the people here. I've had a problem with one person alone but I think that's been put on the back burner via not acknowledging each others presence, which, if you can't get past things, is the best way to go so that neither person is left out on the boards.

I haven't had a problem with any mod here. I like all types of threads. I like the light hearted threads as they're great fun and I also like the deeper threads that you actually have to think in order to participate in.

Kaysar chose who he chose for a reason and personally I think that if we sit here and rank on the mods, we're basically questioning his judgement. If you have a problem with someone, report it to him, if he sees it as an issue, he'll talk to them.

I also don't see a problem with public apologies either. Hey, if they have the balls to do it, more power to them, it takes a lot of guts to do it that way and that needs to be commended, imho.

Seriously, there's a thread, can't remember if it's here or in the BB6 portion, but it's called "Why I Love Kaysar....". Kaysar, hope you don't mind but I copied part of that post, the last part, printed it and hung it outside of my desk at work because it fits so well and I think it fits here......

I would hate to see anyone leave the boards, truly, but I don't think it's fair to say, "This person made me do it...or that person made me do it...". Seriously, noone MADE you do anything, you are choosing to do it. Just like anything in life, someone does/says something and the other person has a choice how to react. Don't give control of your thoughts and actions to another person, I doubt they want it. If you choose to leave, okay, we will miss you because everyone here is a valued member, but please remember that it's your choice to do it and noone elses.

ETA: here's the part of Kaysar's post that I think fits here:

- Why do we fight amongst ourselves when we should encourage positive thought and enlighten our youth and teach them the tools to fight the pressures of society?

- Why do we choose to point fingers when problem arises instead of creating think-tank to advance ourselves?

- Why don't we don't pull our communities together to eradicate social dysfunction and make this a better place to live?

- How do we find the time to pass out flyers and attend protests when we can't seem find enough time in the day to have a healthy conversation with the person next you who doesn't share your point of view?

…Because we are too busy asking the wrong questions.

Thank You,
Kaysar

Peace......Iowagal1975 (btw, you guys are never getting rid of me! ;) )

[lavonne]

A few of us got together last night and decided lthat it is all your fault Melly!

[IowaGal1975]

I will say that Melly is the most hilarious person ever......absofrigginglutley, youknowwhatimsaying? ;)

[lavonne]

Originally posted by IowaGal1975
I will say that Melly is the most hilarious person ever......absofrigginglutley, youknowwhatimsaying? ;)

I sooo hear you...I love that girl, but that doesn't change the fact that it is all her fault:P

[IowaGal1975]

Yeah I know, it's horrible, she's enthusiastic! ;)

[STella668]

When people leave because they do not like what is happening in any situation, it allows the world to foster more of what they do not like.

However, sometimes, you gotta know it's time to get out of Dodge. If I had been a German Jew in the 1930s, I'd likely have ended up sucking Zyklon-B (spelling? Yah, and it disturbs me a bit that I got that right. Hydrocyanic acid.) because I might have missed when it was time to shift from "stay and counter" to "haul tuchkis! NOW!"

Like much of the very fine advice I've been given and cheerfully relay, the problem is knowing when and how to apply it.....

ST*

[lostinks]

Melly, Melly, Melly. What are we going to do with you? We can't have you causing problems again. We'll have to send you to your room. Of course being the kind person I am, I will let you take one person with you. ;) Wonder who that would be. :P

[IowaGal1975]

Well, melly and lostinks, Kaysar's taken. ;)

[melly]

my fault with what?? :P oh no!! wait - you all had a meeting WITHOUT me?! ::gasp:: i am hurt & outraged! was kaysar there? did you all share cookies and cinnamon toast crunch & talk trash about me?!

LOL. ohh the horror!:D "absofrigginlutely" iowagal. :P i likey!

[IowaGal1975]

Hey Jenn , and everyone else, I don't know what's happened between you guys and whoever else but please take note of this. If someone leaves a forum, THEY chose to do that.....Elizabeth and whomever else can't make them leave as they have no control over another persons' actions/thoughts, etc.

To say "He/she made me mad, he/she is making me sad, I'm leaving the boards because of him/her....." is wrong. To say that means they control everything you do and that's not true. They may do/say something that you don't like but it's your choice and your choice alone to decide how to react to that.

[melly]

Originally posted by lostinks
Melly, Melly, Melly. What are we going to do with you? We can't have you causing problems again. We'll have to send you to your room. Of course being the kind person I am, I will let you take one person with you. ;) Wonder who that would be. :P

lostink lostink lostinks....since kaysar is taken. {insert sad face here} i'll have to go with the next best thing - my kaysar doll! whoo hoo! i'm sorry i was being bad. i didnt know i was being bad. please dont spank me or send me to my room. it's oh so LONELY in there. ::sniffles:::(

::peeks out of the door:: can i come out now?! i'll be GOOD!;)

[IowaGal1975]

Melly, you can come out now, as long as you buy me a Kaysar doll! ;)

[janall]

IowaGal1975 ?

Where in this wonderful world are you living?? I ask,because we have an Iowa here in my part of the world :)

[IowaGal1975]

Why Iowa in the Midwest....home of soybeans, corn, cows, pigs...none around me though......OH AND the University of Iowa Hawkeyes, one of THE best college football teams around! ;)

[janall]

Originally posted by IowaGal1975
Why Iowa in the Midwest....home of soybeans, corn, cows, pigs...none around me though......OH AND the University of Iowa Hawkeyes, one of THE best college football teams around! ;)

Ok..way off,except for the corn,cows and pigs...we gotum here also.....none around me either....well maybe a 'pig' here and there ;) lol

[kaysarluvr]

ok guys been trying to stay out of this..but here goes...I HAD a problem with one of the MODS..sent a u2u and it was solved :) simple as that...really!

[IowaGal1975]

lol, the only animal near me is my dog Patrick. And hey kaysarluvr...right on! :)

[lostinks]

IowaGal, where is your quote from? I have heard that before.

Come out now Melly :P time out is over.

.

[IowaGal1975]

It's a song, can't remember who by but very recent and I actually got part of it wrong....it's "I dare you to lift yourself up off the floor..."

[lavonne]

Originally posted by melly
my fault with what?? :P oh no!! wait - you all had a meeting WITHOUT me?! ::gasp:: i am hurt & outraged! was kaysar there? did you all share cookies and cinnamon toast crunch & talk trash about me?!

LOL. ohh the horror!:D "absofrigginlutely" iowagal. :P i likey!

He was lurking in here last night. So...he may have overheard us...:o

If it makes you feel any better, Lane is in more trouble because she wouldn't be quiet...she scared him off...:mad:

[Ashlaefedorov]

Originally posted by kaysarluvr
ok guys been trying to stay out of this..but here goes...I HAD a problem with one of the MODS..sent a u2u and it was solved :) simple as that...really!


Great! Glad things work out between you and one of the mods! :)

[melly]

Originally posted by IowaGal1975
It's a song, can't remember who by but very recent and I actually got part of it wrong....it's "I dare you to lift yourself up off the floor..."

it's *i dare you to move* by SWITCHFOOT! it's my all time favorite song from a movie!! (a walk to remember). man oh man...i LOVE that song. it makes me want to...well, MOVE! :P

[IowaGal1975]

lol melly, I was watching that very movie when I put the lyrics in my sig!

[lostinks]

Originally posted by IowaGal1975
It's a song, can't remember who by but very recent and I actually got part of it wrong....it's "I dare you to lift yourself up off the floor..."

LOL I was thinking maybe I had heard it on Soprano's.

[IowaGal1975]

That would be, "Woke up this morning, got yourself a gun.....poppa always said you'd be the chosen one......"

[lostinks]

Oh Boy!!! Do we have another fan? I love that show.. But I thought it sounded like something Tony said when he finished beating the crap out of that guy in the first epp.

[IowaGal1975]

lol! Well, were you born under a bad sign with a blue moon in your eye? ;)

[lavonne]

Oh Boy!!! Now I am gonna have to watch it...lmao. That means I would have to get up, insert the DVD and sit back down, so, now that I think about it....nah.

[lavonne]

Poor Adria...:(:(:(:(:(:(

First her dog, then her...:(:(

[melly]

Originally posted by lavonne
He was lurking in here last night. So...he may have overheard us...:o

If it makes you feel any better, Lane is in more trouble because she wouldn't be quiet...she scared him off...:mad:

oh no...miss lane is in trouble now huh? LOL. yes, i'm off the hook! excuse me while i step out of my room...

....ah, i'm out now! ::breathes fresh air:: anyhoo, i LOVE lane! she's so helpful! she taught me everything i need to know about being a super mod. professor lane is waay cooler than professor ridha! :P haha

[IowaGal1975]

And that's the one episode I miss.....where she's offed.

[lavonne]

Originally posted by IowaGal1975
And that's the one episode I miss.....where she's offed.

It's so sad...:(:(:(:(:( sniffle:(:(:(:(:(

[lavonne]

Originally posted by melly
Originally posted by lavonne
He was lurking in here last night. So...he may have overheard us...:o

If it makes you feel any better, Lane is in more trouble because she wouldn't be quiet...she scared him off...:mad:

oh no...miss lane is in trouble now huh? LOL. yes, i'm off the hook! excuse me while i step out of my room...

....ah, i'm out now! ::breathes fresh air:: anyhoo, i LOVE lane! she's so helpful! she taught me everything i need to know about being a super mod. professor lane is waay cooler than professor ridha! :P haha

Yeah, she's super-cool...she thought it was pretty funny, I will stop teasing her now...or she will do it again just to get me all wriled up again.:D

[lostinks]

It was heartbreaking. I was sad :(.

My fav. way to spend the day is to curl up on the sofa with a bowl of popcorn and watch my DVD's of The Soprano's. And if I'm still not tired after that, I put in The Godfather. I just make it a mob day. :)

[IowaGal1975]

I like a range of shows myself........

[lavonne]

Originally posted by lostinks
It was heartbreaking. I was sad :(.

My fav. way to spend the day is to curl up on the sofa with a bowl of popcorn and watch my DVD's of The Soprano's. And if I'm still not tired after that, I put in The Godfather. I just make it a mob day. :)

Fuhghet about it! Know what I'm sayin?

[lostinks]

WOW :cool:

[lavonne]

I lpve that movie...my favorite mafia movie of all time.

[Sherry]

Originally posted by Elizabeth
Elizabeth you are not the reason why I am thinking about Leaving! I just wanted to tell you that OK!

Good, because I've put a great deal of effort into making this an interesting forum, even if it means alienating some people.

We can't always have discussions about hair color and what food most resembles you now can we?

Why do you feel you should take it upon yourself to make this an interesting forum?

[IowaGal1975]

I don't think she does Sherry, in that sense, but being a mod means more than just sitting there watching posts. Mods should interact too and personally sometimes you can't please everyone.

[Sherry]

Originally posted by Taelyn

Good, because I've put a great deal of effort into making this an interesting forum, even if it means alienating some people. We can't always have discussions about hair color and what food most resembles you now can we?


Here's some news you may not be aware of !!!
Its not you that makes this forum Interesting Elizabeth,
Its KAYSAR.

And Its members have the right to talk about whatever the hell they want.
EVEN hair color and favorite foods and whatnot.


THANK YOU.... THANK YOU.... THANK YOU TAELYN..............

[IowaGal1975]

Originally posted by Sherry
Originally posted by Taelyn

Good, because I've put a great deal of effort into making this an interesting forum, even if it means alienating some people. We can't always have discussions about hair color and what food most resembles you now can we?


Here's some news you may not be aware of !!!
Its not you that makes this forum Interesting Elizabeth,
Its KAYSAR.

And Its members have the right to talk about whatever the hell they want.
EVEN hair color and favorite foods and whatnot.


THANK YOU.... THANK YOU.... THANK YOU TAELYN..............

Okay folks, let's not forget that it was KAYSAR who chose Elizabeth. So, what does that say to you? That he doesn't know what he's doing? Obviously he saw something there that seemed fit to him to put her in a mod position.

Anyways, I'm going to bed and I don't want to start a fight but seriously, after everything that's happened here do we want to start this up again? *scratches head* I don't get it.

[Sherry]

Originally posted by Elizabeth
I'll be back later to pick up the discussion. Right now I have a business to run.

What exactly is your business?
Every time I log on, be it in the a.m before going to work, taking a break at work or in the late evening you are here. You have mentioned owning your own business numerous times, however, I must have missed something, I have no clue what you are talking about.

[Sherry]

Originally posted by Jenn
When K asked me to moderate, he didn't say, "Hey, do you want to moderate and if so, could you turn down the personality?"

Did I call it, or did I CALL IT? LOL

Actually, you could not have called it any better

[IowaGal1975]

Oh my holy dear god, some people just can't let things go....and no offense to anyone, but is this an argument that seriously needs to be drawn out this long or is it just something that people can't let go of?

There are people in this country today, scattered, not knowing where their families are, where their pets are, where they're going to live, how they're going to work....there's a war going on.....there's a LOT of things going on in this world today and THIS is what some are focusing on?

[Sherry]

Originally posted by Taelyn
I agree completely, what I have a problem with is her assumption that we are incapable of that without her "leadership".
I find that offensive and absurd.

I also see no problem with the lighthearted threads, I think they are fun and amusing in an often volotile atmosphere.


I totally agree. I'm wondering if Kaysar made another judgment call like the one he made in the pressure cooker. :(:(

[Sherry]

Originally posted by Jenn
The argument is being presented that some people have problems with the mod-ship because we are against intelligent threads, and that's a totally unfair and self-serving summation of the position.


Just because it bears repeating... Maybe if she reads it enough, she might actually get it.


We can try...

[IowaGal1975]

Originally posted by Sherry
Originally posted by Taelyn
I agree completely, what I have a problem with is her assumption that we are incapable of that without her "leadership".
I find that offensive and absurd.

I also see no problem with the lighthearted threads, I think they are fun and amusing in an often volotile atmosphere.


I totally agree. I'm wondering if Kaysar made another judgment call like the one he made in the pressure cooker. :(:(

I'm thinking that Kaysar is quite capable of deciding who his mods should be and he had a darn good reason when he picked each one and who the heck are any of us to question that? Try U2U's, seriously, they do sometimes work. :)

[IowaGal1975]

Alright, I'm really going to bed now and hopefully some people will remember to eat their Wheaties tomorrow morning and then realize what truly important things there are to be concerned about in this world.....

[Jenn]

There are people in this country today, scattered, not knowing where their families are, where their pets are, where they're going to live, how they're going to work....there's a war going on.....there's a LOT of things going on in this world today and THIS is what some are focusing on?

Strawman alert, strawman alert! If this is your argument, then ANY post in this forum is not worth focusing on, is it? Not a single one. Why are you even here, then?

Okay folks, let's not forget that it was KAYSAR who chose Elizabeth. So, what does that say to you? That he doesn't know what he's doing?

Maybe. Maybe he didn't know what he was doing. Kaysar is not infallible, you know. It could be he just didn't know this girl well enough before picking her to be a mod. If he did know, and he picked this moderator based on who would alienate the most posters - then I guess he did know what he was doing. *shrug* I just don't know.

[Jenn]

Alright, I'm really going to bed now and hopefully some people will remember to eat their Wheaties tomorrow morning and then realize what truly important things there are to be concerned about in this world.....

I'll eat my wheaties if you promise to skip the kool-aid. I agree that there are truly important things to be concerned about - so why are YOU so concerned about people wanting to vent their opinions on this matter? You're just contradicting yourself here.

[VeryFineWhine]

Iowa I was going to keep my fingers shut, but your post really made me want to reply. I hadn't read this thread because I don't come to the board that often and post even less. I joined when Kaysar started it because I hoped and erroneously assumed the forum would primarily be a reflection of Kaysar....intelligent, interesting, insightful, thought provoking and FUN. Sadly I personally haven't found it to be that.

Now that's not to say that it isn't perfect for some fans and I sincerly hope they are having a blast. I have stayed hoping as Kaysar has free time he might jump in more and some topics I find interesting might pop up in addition to the bountiful rah rah we love you posts (which after the 10,000 does get a bit boring to read to me), and then mods who seem to have their own vision and private fights between people. None of these have made me want to sit and chat and interact. Or, for that matter, post I'm leaving because I can do exactly what I did....visit the board as is convenient for me and post if I'm ever motivated, as now.

But I do wonder how many like me are out there, who come here looking for one type of board and interaction and find it missing here?? Just sharing my thoughts...hope that is ok. Oh and Iowa what made me post? The fact that folks are being judged for having the nerve to post how they feel still, versus being led off topic. That just bothered me because to me it seems to be very, very far away from how Kaysar is, and am I wrong or isn't this forum his, and supposed to be a reflection of him? I might be missing the mark and would NEVER speak for him or anyone else, but that is my take on this. And btw, I have visited some wonderful Katrina boards and would be delighted to share the links with you if you want, but since this is Kaysar's board I fail to see why folks can't discuss what is bothering them as relates to him and his forum here, and above everyone what got me typing is that folks should feel guilty for saying how they feel and think about this. So that is why I decided I would explain what I am feeling.

[Sherry]

Originally posted by Jenn
I just don't wish to be interpreted as an a$$ki$$er simply because I like someone who is strong willed.


Well - deb - I apologize for any comments made in the past, present or future. That way - if I say something offensive in the future - it's OK because I've already apologized for it. And my apology is equally as sincere as Elizabeths. Really.


:P:P:P:P:P:P:P:P:P:P:P:P:P

[Sherry]

Originally posted by jerrij
Originally posted by Jenn
I'm going to take a minute from the elizabeth ass-kissing session to say it's great that you love who you are, you don't want to change, and several people don't want you to change. But the bottom line is that you are a divisive figure on this board. I saw it BEFORE you came a moderator, and it's become worse even AFTER.

I don't think anyone would care if you were outspoken, or had differences of opinion, but these qualities are affecting your 'job' as moderator. It's not affecting your job BECAUSE you have differences of opinion, but because you have named yourself judge and jury for every 'regular' poster and 'lurker', you have it clear in your mind who are the 'troublemakers' (and of course, you are not one them LOL), and you act on such biases, whether wrong or right. By clearly making a distinction that 'regulars' are to be favored, you are making this place very unwelcoming for newbies. I don't think that is what Kaysar wants.

Melly and Lane are both great moderators because they rarely, if ever, take sides, make judgements about posters based on something asinine like their post count (some people have jobs, you know!), or promote themselves the way you do. I'm sure you are a great person - but that doesn't automatically make you a good moderator. A moderator is supposed to mediate disputes, not be at the center of them, or in many cases - the instigator of them.

When you say this: "I've found apologies, whether necessary or not, go a long way." - I find your apology to be insincere. You are pretty much saying that you think it wasn't necessary - but you're just doing it to 'be the bigger person'. If you this were true - you wouldn't have to point it out.

Before anyone gets on my case about not handling this through U2U - I don't 'do' U2U for stuff like this. Messages have a way of becoming forwarded and altered in situations like these.


*puts on flame retardent suit*http://www2.dupont.com/Personal_Protection/en_US/assets/application/images/en/productsServices/products/ThermoPro.jpg

I am with Jenn on this one.

What happened the other day was the worse case of moderating I have ever seen and if it keeps up Kaysar won't have a board.



Exactly. Hopefully he will find time to moderate his moderator.

[Sherry]

Originally posted by Jenn
and moderators getting power hungry and having an ill-effect on the board.


And you don't think that's happened? I do. And I'm not alone, that's for sure. And as far as censorship is concerned - I'm not worried about Elizabeth censoring our posts because I don't think she's that stupid. But, people ARE censoring THEMSELVES because of her.

And, the moment Kaysar decides to ban people for disagreeing with him, then, yes, this became a censorship board, and the man would no longer have my respect.

For the record - I do not think Kaysar WOULD ban somebody for disagreeing with his choice of moderator. I said that because I've seen that tactic here before. many times when elizabeth tries to justify her actions, her attitude and her responses are always along the lines of "I'm gonna do what I'm gonna do and if Kaysar wants it to change, he will take care of it". IMO, she's trying to invoke the name of kaysar in order to placate the masses. We've seen other people use that technique - but the name was "cappy". It worked then - and it pretty much works now, here - ironically.

Once again, I totally agree with Jenn. We must be communicating telepathically tonight Jenn.

[Sherry]

Originally posted by blueeyesdebbie22
Originally posted by Taelyn
I think what needs to be noted here is this.

Melly, is a very very outspoken force on this board, However , Ive not seen or heard *1* negative post about her as a Moderator.

Lane, Is a strong quiet Moderator who does her job , but in a quiet and efficient manner. again not *1*negative post or comment on her Modding.

Thats to be applauded.

I've also noted a screaming silence from them in any of the more opinionated threads. Not a bad thing either, as they dont jump to defend or condem anyone.
They dont feel the need to be center of attention, or CONTROL the boards...
Its not a MODS job to Direct or steer a board, they are here to DIFFUSE, and "Moderate"


Elizabeth is a very smart, talented, outspoken,opinionated person with alot of creativity, but maybe she is a tad "TOO" outspoken. It seems to be getting her in a lot of heat here.

Maybe instead of an apology , a little self-examination and a step back is in order, perhaps learn a little from your fellow Mods and follow in their quiet unobtrusive footsteps.Stop trying to LEAD..and just BE THERE when you are called and/or needed.
Afterall, thats what you are here for.

Not to lead, but to assist.

Just my opinion
Taelyn

I think that was very well put and I do agree with a lot that you said in that post. You were not rude or mean in any way, and you still got the point across :)

Amen....

[Sherry]

Elizabeth:

We want your DOR

[lavonne]

Funny...ha ha...

Now drop it.

[flowerpower]

When kaysar open this forum, everyone was so excited & happy to join. Now it seems everyone is jumping ship, I have been to howie's forum & michael's, and I see that alot of the people who are members here are there now and say they won't come back. People are bashing this forum so much is crazy, because of the negative posts, because of Elizabeth, I don't understand, and now they have started on kaysar because he doesn't post as much or because he made Liz a mod. If these keeps up I'm afraid kaysar will just shut this forum down, do you guys want that to happen, I dont. So " can we all just get along";);););););););).

[RhyanShae]

I am trying my best to be diplomatic about the Kaysar posting more on his forum topic that keeps reproducing itself here, on Michael's forum, and on other reality topics because I don't want to sound like I'm speaking for him.

A lot of people joined the board to have a chance to talk to Kaysar. The sheer magnitude of people who want a chunk of Kaysar is unimaginable to me, and I honestly cringe when I hear the whining about Kaysar not posting and the threats to leave because he's not paying attention enough to the board. He's paying attention. He's being himself. If he wants to post, he's going to. No amount of "Kaysar, Kaysar" will make him post if he simply doesn't want to.

He's using this forum and this myspace to talk through messages with fans (PM on Myspace and U2U here) and keep them updated on his life. There are, again, a huge number of people who post on this board expecting a personal message from him for every post they make. That's a HUGE amount of expectation for anyone.

We're a community. A family, of sorts, and if you wanna think of it, the extended family. There will be fights. There will be disagreements. Sometimes, yes, hurt feelings. Sometimes, people won't understand where another is coming from and misinterpret words. Sometimes, people won't talk to each other for a long time, if at all.

But, to leave this community because of a disagreement with one member? You're devaluing the fact that the one member, regardless of position is just ONE member. There are hundreds of people visiting every day, some posting more than others. Some are nicer. Some aren't.

Leave the board because it's not your cup of tea. Leave the board because your expectations for it were different. Leave the board because most of the members piss you off. Don't leave because of one person.

And, don't leave just cause Kaysar's still trying to find the time and attention to give to it. This new life for him is, from what I can guess, still pretty big to him, and I'm sure he's adjusting everything to fit it. In that time, we can try to get along and kinda just make sure this place is still active when he has the time, or we can all pack up and leave because of impatience.

But a point made was true. Don't blame the choice you make to leave on someone else. Unless you're banned, you're not forced to leave.

[Elizabeth]

Rhyan,

I'm sitting here with coffee and a pie and was just thinking of you. Come on over. :)

[flowerpower]

To Elizabeth:
I don't have a problem with you, I think you're doing a great job. All 3 of the mods are unique, and I like that.

[RhyanShae]

PIE! Do you have caffeine too! I have pie to bring. We could have a pie party!

Sorry I'm late. I work nights tonight and tomorrow. Friday night, though, I'll be up for a long while. Yay!

[Wise_Diva]

GOOD GREIF...Is this still going on....Agree to disagree & move on to haveing fun....or as some have mentioned, put your energy into something of merit...

Now I'll shut up, & go back to semi-lurkdom...:cool::cool::cool:

[beautybabe]

Originally posted by RhyanShae

We're a community. A family, of sorts, and if you wanna think of it, the extended family. There will be fights. There will be disagreements. Sometimes, yes, hurt feelings. Sometimes, people won't understand where another is coming from and misinterpret words. Sometimes, people won't talk to each other for a long time, if at all.


We are definitely a family. Incredibly dysfunctional but nonetheless still a family ;)

[Ashlaefedorov]

Out of all the 3 mods Lane is the ONLY Mod I like here! Kaysar made a great choice when he picked her! But Elizabeth and Melly well............ very very bad choices to me they are bad choices!! Sorry if I offend anybody! I am saying how I feel! Elizabeth and Melly just get on my ****ing nerves!

[IowaGal1975]

Originally posted by Wise_Diva
GOOD GREIF...Is this still going on....Agree to disagree & move on to haveing fun....or as some have mentioned, put your energy into something of merit...

Now I'll shut up, & go back to semi-lurkdom...:cool::cool::cool:

Exactly my point and perhaps I didn't state it the best way.

Now, back to enjoying all things Kaysar.

[IowaGal1975]

sorry, clicked wrong.

[IowaGal1975]

But, to leave this community because of a disagreement with one member? You're devaluing the fact that the one member, regardless of position is just ONE member. There are hundreds of people visiting every day, some posting more than others. Some are nicer. Some aren't.

Leave the board because it's not your cup of tea. Leave the board because your expectations for it were different. Leave the board because most of the members piss you off. Don't leave because of one person.

And, don't leave just cause Kaysar's still trying to find the time and attention to give to it. This new life for him is, from what I can guess, still pretty big to him, and I'm sure he's adjusting everything to fit it. In that time, we can try to get along and kinda just make sure this place is still active when he has the time, or we can all pack up and leave because of impatience.

But a point made was true. Don't blame the choice you make to leave on someone else. Unless you're banned, you're not forced to leave. [/quote]

Jesus god in heaven girl, where have you been all my life?!? lol! That was fantastic and exactly what I feel.

Elizabeth: We do NOT want your DOR girl, you sit back and Kaysar, if you read this, I am SO sorry that it got to this point.

Kaysar can't be expected to tend to everyone here personally. Christ, he'd be here all day every day and the man does have a very new and very emerging life beginning. Yes, he does his best here but I also am not going to question his judgement on mods.

I dare anyone to find a message board, unless it's a small private group with very few members, in which every single person gets along harmoniously around the camp fire singing "Koombayah"(sp?). That won't happen and you know what? That's sad too in a sense but it's human nature. That's why I so totally loved the post that Elizabeth stickeyed "This is the Kaysar that I love..". I beg everyone to go read what he wrote, especially the last part, it's something that, in the few short days since I've read it, I've been thinking about a lot.

Why do we, when faced with conflict, sit and neglect the conversations that could be had with someone we don't share opinions with? Why is conflict dragged out unnecessarily for days on end when the more logical solution could be to calmly try to find a solution? Because we're not asking the right questions.......we're stubborn, heck I know I am.

Okay, I'm shutting up now but dear god......opinions are good. Voicing them is a good thing too, get them out and vent and then move beyond that to find a solution; whether that be working out differences OR deciding to disagree and perhaps what's best is not communicating at all.

[Ginamarie]

Originally posted by RhyanShae
I am trying my best to be diplomatic about the Kaysar posting more on his forum topic that keeps reproducing itself here, on Michael's forum, and on other reality topics because I don't want to sound like I'm speaking for him.

A lot of people joined the board to have a chance to talk to Kaysar. The sheer magnitude of people who want a chunk of Kaysar is unimaginable to me, and I honestly cringe when I hear the whining about Kaysar not posting and the threats to leave because he's not paying attention enough to the board. He's paying attention. He's being himself. If he wants to post, he's going to. No amount of "Kaysar, Kaysar" will make him post if he simply doesn't want to.

He's using this forum and this myspace to talk through messages with fans (PM on Myspace and U2U here) and keep them updated on his life. There are, again, a huge number of people who post on this board expecting a personal message from him for every post they make. That's a HUGE amount of expectation for anyone.

We're a community. A family, of sorts, and if you wanna think of it, the extended family. There will be fights. There will be disagreements. Sometimes, yes, hurt feelings. Sometimes, people won't understand where another is coming from and misinterpret words. Sometimes, people won't talk to each other for a long time, if at all.

But, to leave this community because of a disagreement with one member? You're devaluing the fact that the one member, regardless of position is just ONE member. There are hundreds of people visiting every day, some posting more than others. Some are nicer. Some aren't.

Leave the board because it's not your cup of tea. Leave the board because your expectations for it were different. Leave the board because most of the members piss you off. Don't leave because of one person.

And, don't leave just cause Kaysar's still trying to find the time and attention to give to it. This new life for him is, from what I can guess,