What Would You Do???

[tweety_kiss]

I know this is an unusual post but since this is general chat, I know I can safely bring this up here and also most of us regulars in this section have gotten to know each other and like one another.

This woman I have known for the past 30 years(I grew up with her much of my life) had been my best friend all these years.

She is also a Big Brother fan. In fact, she is the one who informed me about it three years ago and I watched BB2 like crazy. I didn't watch it again until BB6 since other things came up past seasons and I am glad I saw it this time since it was great. My friend watched each and every season and liked this one the best too.

Now here is where the conflict lies; for the past so many weeks all she keeps saying that "Maggie played a good game and she should win the money". That really offended me and none of us needs to go there since we all know what Maggie is about.

As most of us know, Kaysar wrote in the CBS blog what type of person Maggie represents and I 200% agree with him.

What is really bothering me now is the fact that I get the feeling my friend is really another Maggie and Ivette. Am I being too hard on her by thinking this or would you keep being friends with someone like this? There have also been other issues with her in the recent years that had me wondering about her and I told her last Spring about something where I thought she was wrong and then she didn't even email for months. I was not the one who broke off, it was her. Then she calls me out of nowhere a couple of months ago and asks me if I was still mad at her and I told her I was not. She then went on to say that I had hurt her feelings in the last email back in the Spring, but then everyone she said many hurtful and hateful things in the recent years.

I have not had any communication with this person since the finale night since I don't want to associate with people who are like the fiendsheep and we get enough of them who slip through the cracks to get on here. Like they say, you can know someone for a whole lifetime and not really know them at all.

[Debookwrm]

Does your friend have the 24/7 feeds? Because that could seriously change her perception of the house guests. I watched the feeds and then the show...and it seemed to me that until the end, they tried to show the other side in a positive light. Maybe she doesn't really know?

Deb

[Lamia]

i don't think it's too much of a big deal. she's allowed to like whomever she wants. or is it 'whoever'? hmm, this is going to bother me all day.

[tweety_kiss]

Originally posted by Debookwrm
Does your friend have the 24/7 feeds? Because that could seriously change her perception of the house guests. I watched the feeds and then the show...and it seemed to me that until the end, they tried to show the other side in a positive light. Maybe she doesn't really know?

Deb

I doubt she even had the feeds since either they don't have credit cards because they filed bankruptcy or they just don't charge unless it is emergency. Like I will now state, she swears never to confide in me but I HAVE TO AND MUST tell her everything. That is another story.

To answer your question, I seriously doubt it knowing they won't spend on that, but still. The TV did edit some things but there were some nasty things that were shown done and said by the fiendsheep and she could have always gone to Jokers Updates like most watchers did. I mean Yapril called us pieces of "you know what" the night Janelle won a phone call from Michael and they all made such a big fuss on it like we all commited a crime by voting for that moment. I was very upset that night by their actions.

[Jenn]

I have several friends that like GWBush -and even though I despise the man, it doesn't affect my friendship with them because people are allowed to have their own opinions. I think they are wrong, they think I am wrong, but we debate about it and move on because there are so many other reasons we are friends that an argument about politics means nothing in the long run. That is called being 'tolerant'.

Same thing here - no matter why your friend likes Maggie, whether she watched live feeds or not, it's just an opinion about a tv character. If you think that a difference of opinion about a reality contestant is worth trashing your friendship - then it's probably not a good friendship to begin with. If you only like to hang out with people that think as you do, then maybe YOU are more like the Maggie and Ivette than you think you are. Remember, the friendsheep were not allowed to like or be friends with any of the sovereign or it was considered an 'act against the friendship'. Don't you think your reaction to your friends opinions about maggie is along the same lines?

[Debookwrm]

I understand but if you think back...the CBS version of the show never really showed Maggie as being that bad. She was very cautious in the DR. If you didn't know the way things really were...I can see it being perceived another way. And many of us might consider that she was the angel who was trying to find the good in the others in her group. An ER nurse trying to finish what her beloved Fireman friend began...you get my drift.

However, that being said, is it this particular incident that is making you think that perhaps this is not a person you want to be around, or is it the accumulation of many things and this is just the icing on the cake?

We're all a little emotionally invested...well some of us...in BB6 and our beloved Sov. Perhaps if it's just this one thing you need some distance to get perspective...if it's an accumulation...then it's probably time to let go. We need and like positive influences in our lives. If there's someone who makes us feel bad all the time, it's probably time to say adieu.

Deb

[Lamia]

if i had friends that liked bush.....well i don't know if they'd be my friend.

[Debookwrm]

Originally posted by Jenn
I have several friends that like GWBush -and even though I despise the man, it doesn't affect my friendship with them because people are allowed to have their own opinions. I think they are wrong, they think I am wrong, but we debate about it and move on because there are so many other reasons we are friends that an argument about politics means nothing in the long run. That is called being 'tolerant'.

Same thing here - no matter why your friend likes Maggie, whether she watched live feeds or not, it's just an opinion about a tv character. If you think that a difference of opinion about a reality contestant is worth trashing your friendship - then it's probably not a good friendship to begin with. If you only like to hang out with people that think as you do, then maybe YOU are more like the Maggie and Ivette than you think you are. Remember, the friendsheep were not allowed to like or be friends with any of the sovereign or it was considered an 'act against the friendship'. Don't you think your reaction to your friends opinions about maggie is along the same lines?

Tolerance is absolutely the right answer if it's just this one thing that's making you upset.

Deb

[JLittmann]

Originally posted by tweety_kiss
I know this is an unusual post but since this is general chat, I know I can safely bring this up here and also most of us regulars in this section have gotten to know each other and like one another.

This woman I have known for the past 30 years(I grew up with her much of my life) had been my best friend all these years.

She is also a Big Brother fan. In fact, she is the one who informed me about it three years ago and I watched BB2 like crazy. I didn't watch it again until BB6 since other things came up past seasons and I am glad I saw it this time since it was great. My friend watched each and every season and liked this one the best too.

Now here is where the conflict lies; for the past so many weeks all she keeps saying that "Maggie played a good game and she should win the money". That really offended me and none of us needs to go there since we all know what Maggie is about.

As most of us know, Kaysar wrote in the CBS blog what type of person Maggie represents and I 200% agree with him.

What is really bothering me now is the fact that I get the feeling my friend is really another Maggie and Ivette. Am I being too hard on her by thinking this or would you keep being friends with someone like this? There have also been other issues with her in the recent years that had me wondering about her and I told her last Spring about something where I thought she was wrong and then she didn't even email for months. I was not the one who broke off, it was her. Then she calls me out of nowhere a couple of months ago and asks me if I was still mad at her and I told her I was not. She then went on to say that I had hurt her feelings in the last email back in the Spring, but then everyone she said many hurtful and hateful things in the recent years.

I have not had any communication with this person since the finale night since I don't want to associate with people who are like the fiendsheep and we get enough of them who slip through the cracks to get on here. Like they say, you can know someone for a whole lifetime and not really know them at all.

I can totally relate! In my case, this friend and I also had previous problems, but somehow Big Brother acted as a kind of lightning rod to illuminate other tacit issues.

My spidey senses are telling me that your case is similar- it's not the show; it's your gut instinct that this friend does not wish you well. Honour that feeling - it's not about Maggie, or the show, it's about you understanding what kind of friends you want and choosing high caliber people.

The way I see it is this: say, you wake up with 100 emotional units every day. Some pleasurable and/or productive people and activites add to that number, and some everyday nuisance events subtract from them. So, my day might be like this:

coffee with seinfeld-style friend = +35 units
shopping with sanctimonious friend = -47 units
worrying about sanctimonious friend gossiping later = -14 units
doing laundry and errands = -10

You can't control some events in your life that give you stress, but you can control with whom you choose to spend social time.
My friend was a Maggie, and only took and took emotional energy (extracting constant assurances of friendship, getting upset about outside friends, etc) without ever being fun, creative, or amusing.

Well, anyway, it's up to you. I went on and on - sorry about that! : D But it seems clear from your post that Big Brother is not the real issue, it's just the thing that clarified the real problems.

Cheers

p.s. Lamia - I think it's whomever there, because it is in the object sense.

[Lamia]

haha, thanks. whomever sounded right.

[bambiangel]

Well I would worry about it depending on how long the friendship is and how close you were to her....You know just by watching the show maggie came off as quiet and the glue that held her group together ..So it was easy for alot of people to like her they never aired her trash..as far as your friend if you have qualms about her , my thoughts is bring it out in the open and if the 2 of you cannot work out the issues you both seem to have... Then at least you know where you stand with her , but just because she liked maggot doesnt make her the maggot type...I hope it can be resolved..:)

[DelilahJones]

Hmm, there are a few things I'll share my opinion on, however, being so removed from the situation, it won't hurt my feelings if you totally disregard what I have to say. :)

First, you mentioned that your friend has said a lot of hurtful things to you in the past. When she said these things to you, did you bring them up with her and address why what she said had hurt you? Often, people don't realize how strongly their words can affect the people around them. Do you think she said these things to intentionally hurt you, or was she just stating her opinions/feelings on things without taking into consideration how her words may affect you? If she is someone who would say things to harm you on any level then she certainly wasn't a true "friend" in the first place. If not, then maybe she's just a little insensitive, and discussing your feelings with her may be the way to go.

Second, let's move onto the Big Brother issue. If she just watched the show on CBS, she would have a very different idea of the houseguests than people such as myself (crazy obsessed live feed watchers, lol). Granted, I know many people who just watched the show who still hated the crappy cult, but the edited episodes didn't really paint a full portrait of the people in the house.

Thinking that Maggie "played a good game", doesn't mean your friend is just like Maggie. I loved Howie in the game, but he and I are completely un-alike. Completely. Just because I loved how he was in the BB house, it doesn't mean that I am like him, or that I agree with every facet of his personality. I hope that makes sense, I just woke up here, hehe.

I just turned 30, and I have known my best friend for half of my life now. She's going to be my MOH in my upcoming wedding, and no matter what comes up, I know I can rely on her. There is one area where he have completely opposing views however...politics. She is very very republican, and I am very anti-republican. I'm not really a democrat, and I think our political parties are a joke. If anything, I am most like a Socliaist. I don't think you can get more opposing than socialist and republican. We can actually discuss politics, without getting heated or upset. We listen to each others opinions, calmly debate, and at the end, pop open another bottle of champagne and move onto a different topic.

There are a lot of things that the republican party represent to me that I really really don't care for. Ok, it's worse than that, there are many things about the republican party that churn my stomach and make my blood boil, *but*, I don't now project those things onto her because she is a republican.

My point is that good friends should be able disagree, even on major issues, and still remain good friends at the end of the day. I hope that you can figure out if this person is really someone you want to remain friends with. I would really focus more on the times she has said hurtful things to you, and try to figure out if it was intentional or not, and make my decision from there. Communication is key in *any* relationship, because it's the only way to understand where the other person is coming from.

I hope this works out for you so that you can come through this situation with something positive. Best of luck to you.

[tweety_kiss]

Originally posted by Jenn
I have several friends that like GWBush -and even though I despise the man, it doesn't affect my friendship with them because people are allowed to have their own opinions. I think they are wrong, they think I am wrong, but we debate about it and move on because there are so many other reasons we are friends that an argument about politics means nothing in the long run. That is called being 'tolerant'.

Same thing here - no matter why your friend likes Maggie, whether she watched live feeds or not, it's just an opinion about a tv character. If you think that a difference of opinion about a reality contestant is worth trashing your friendship - then it's probably not a good friendship to begin with. If you only like to hang out with people that think as you do, then maybe YOU are more like the Maggie and Ivette than you think you are. Remember, the friendsheep were not allowed to like or be friends with any of the sovereign or it was considered an 'act against the friendship'. Don't you think your reaction to your friends opinions about maggie is along the same lines?

This is not just the Big Brother issue as I stated. I know I never said this, but she always thinks her opinion is the only right way and everybody is wrong and uneducated. she is one who loves to dictate to others how to think. I didn't go into details earlier because that would have took much more space.

I never once said I only hang with people that think like I do. Just an example here; on Martha's Apprentice, I don't care for Jim but I know others who like him and want him to get hired and that is fine with me. I also know not everyone liked Kendra who was hired last season by Donald and I still like those people because they are good people.

Did you ever read what Kaysar said on the CBS blog about Maggie? He is the one who had to stay in the house with her so he got to know what she is about. Most people who watched BB6 don't like the fiendsheep as you probably know.

Before you think I am like Maggie and Ivette, I don't go around putting down people for their heritage and religious beliefs.

[bambiangel]

Originally posted by Lamia
if i had friends that liked bush.....well i don't know if they'd be my friend. :P:P:P I have relatives who like Bush,what can I do about them ?

[DelilahJones]

Originally posted by Jenn
I have several friends that like GWBush -and even though I despise the man, it doesn't affect my friendship with them because people are allowed to have their own opinions. I think they are wrong, they think I am wrong, but we debate about it and move on because there are so many other reasons we are friends that an argument about politics means nothing in the long run. That is called being 'tolerant'.

Same thing here - no matter why your friend likes Maggie, whether she watched live feeds or not, it's just an opinion about a tv character. If you think that a difference of opinion about a reality contestant is worth trashing your friendship - then it's probably not a good friendship to begin with. If you only like to hang out with people that think as you do, then maybe YOU are more like the Maggie and Ivette than you think you are. Remember, the friendsheep were not allowed to like or be friends with any of the sovereign or it was considered an 'act against the friendship'. Don't you think your reaction to your friends opinions about maggie is along the same lines?

Hmm, I started writing my post before there were any responses. When I hit send, there was nearly a page of them.

I think it's interesting that we brought up the same issue...politics (republicans!). How strange is that? =P

[tweety_kiss]

Originally posted by bambiangel
Originally posted by Lamia
if i had friends that liked bush.....well i don't know if they'd be my friend. :P:P:P I have relatives who like Bush,what can I do about them ?

I also have relatives who like Bush and it does not affect me. LOL!!!

JLittmann,

I see we are in the same boat. At one time, this person was a positive influence, then in the recent years she became very negative and controversial and always brought up things that she knew we would not agree on. So what I will say is that she likes drama and starting fights. I never responded to any controversial topics with her and that is why I don't talk about Maggie with her. She is someone who cannot agree without fighting. I know others who can.

Thanks for sharing your input and what happened with you.

Delilah,

It is great that the two of you can agree to disagree. Unfortunately this is someone who will never agree to disagree. Either it is her way or no way.

[DelilahJones]

[/quote]


Delilah,

It is great that the two of you can agree to disagree. Unfortunately this is someone who will never agree to disagree. Either it is her way or no way. [/quote]

Then if she refuses to respect that you're entitled to your opinions and she doesn't see your opinions being as valid as hers, that I can't see that she's really that good of a friend. Friends should help lift you up, not put you down.

[bambiangel]

Ditto!!!! to what DelilahJones said!!!

[tweety_kiss]

Delilah,

That has entered my mind many times and then I keep wondering why does she even call me and email me?

Her idea of a conversation is to continually bash someone else like she did John Kerry and Therese Heinz last year along with many other people. I won't go into all the details about the others since that could mean writing a post the size of a phone book.

Yes, I understand many don't like Kerry but this is a woman who will constantly bash those who are good in many ways but will admire those who are not that great. I mean I was never a big Kerry fan, but I just didn't care for Bush.

[DelilahJones]

She may have a hard time making new friends. Many people don't like to associate with others who tend to be all about the negative. People who always have bad things to say about other people, situations, etc. It could be that because you've known each other so long, she thinks that you'll always be there to deal with her BS.

If a relationship is hurtful to you, and you find that you can't discuss with the other person the issues you're having, and it's not going to get any better, you may want to distance yourself completely. You can always send her an email, and explain to her why you feel that it's not a healthy friendship for you to stay in. You can explain to her how damaging her words and actions have been to you in the past. If she's the type of person that she sounds like however, your words won't affect her and she'll find a way to turn it around onto you, so I'm not sure what\the best way to handle the situation would be.

If you are having so many doubts about this person, then it would seem that something is wrong, and you're probably going to be happier without this person in your life.

[anii]

Hi tweety - thanks for the post.

My opinion? It would be really sad if a 30-year-long friendship ended over a disagreement about a reality show.

Have you tried talking to your friend about this in a safe and neutral setting?

While I agree that the division btw the nerdherd and the Sov 6-8 is kinda like the one btw Dems and Reps (no middle ground), maybe since you've known each other for so long, there is some space in middle that you can share.

One thing that piqued my interest: you mentioned she said that you'd hurt her feelings but failed to acknowledge that she'd hurt you, correct? Does she apologize when wrong? Does she take responsibility for her own actions when they are hurtful? If so, then this friendship is worth saving and you can agree to disagree about BB6, politics, whatever. If not, then she really does sound like a nerdherder and you may want to cut your losses.

I read a book about coaching and it has some good advice about letting friends go when they become too draining of your energy, or toxic. This frees you up to allow new people in your life, people around whom you feel at your best.

Hope this helps. :)

[Lala]

Sometimes you have to weed your social garden, so to speak. If this person doesn't make you feel good, you should probably part ways.

[RhyanShae]

Honestly? I know people, as many of the others who've posted, like this. They were people I refused to give up on, as I am a person who gives second chances until I absolutely cannot take it anymore. I know the type that when you try to defend yourself, it's an attack. Anything that might make them feel bad, guilty, or otherwise be seen as picking on any part of them or their behavior is an attack, and they lash out.

These people are like parasites, and I hate to put it like that, but they are. They seek nice people with good hearts, and develop a friendship. Then, when they've got it, they think, as someone else said, they've found someone who will put up with their bs and feed them. They live off of it, and as you mentioned, start fights with the purpose.

They yell and say you're the wrong one, you're the one being inflamatory, etc, because it makes them out to look good (to themselves, of course). Any real debate is an attack, as I said earlier.

My advice, not knowing either of you well enough, is that you need to break this relationship for your own sake. A friend who cannot respect you, and intentionally starts conflict isn't looking for friendship, and is an abusive type. You seem like such a nice person that it makes me sad she does this to you.

And, whether or not the Maggie like or dislike matters, I think it's just icing on the cake in this instance. I've talked to people who didn't like Kaysar (said he was overly arrogant, etc), and while I didn't agree, they respected me and acted okay. I think she probably is of the type that agrees manipulation is a good game strategy, and in that case, yes, Maggie did play a good game.

....


OT: My personal opinion is that Maggie played a good game in that she got her own group to sacrifice for her. She did it in what I find are horrible ways, and she participated in a lot of horrible things, and I dislike her so much for it, but she did play a good game in the event that she won it. Whether it was the gameplay to respect and consider good in the TRUE sense, well, no, it wasn't.

[tweety_kiss]

Hi Anii, Lala and Shae(Can I call you Shae?),

All of you are so right. I have really had enough and yes this was the icing on the cake so to speak. I just needed to see what others thought just like one goes and gets a second opinion and I see here that everyone on this thread says this gal is not really a friend.

Yes, I was second guessing myself on this since this person and I have a 30 year history. If this was someone I just met last year, I wouldn't have wasted a thread on Kaysar's board on it.

Shae,

You are right that Maggie's version of a good game was all that manipulation and intimidation to her little friends. I mean she developed all the followers and brainwashed them just so they can sacrifice the winnings that they came into the BB house for.

Kaysar on the other hand played an honest game.

I agree with everything you said in your post and I really enjoyed your post.

"Tweety"

[RhyanShae]

You can call me Shae. I like picking names where others call me what they like. :)

I'm glad you enjoyed my post, and I agree with your thoughts on Maggie's gameplaying as well. I think as Kaysar said in his Fishbowl interview, he wanted to give the world a different view of Iraqi and Muslim people, but also a view on how these reality programs could be played. That's why he's loved. He played the game how many saw themselves playing it.

Of course, it doesn't hurt that he's a great person outside of the game either. Never, really, have I ever seen someone on a reality program reach out to the public like he and Michael have. It's sorta surreal to me because it's at a level much higher than any before.

[Sherry]

Originally posted by Debookwrm
Does your friend have the 24/7 feeds? Because that could seriously change her perception of the house guests. I watched the feeds and then the show...and it seemed to me that until the end, they tried to show the other side in a positive light. Maybe she doesn't really know?

Deb

I also have a good friend who likes Maggie and Ivette AND she did not like Janelle. She didn't have the 24/7 feeds nor did she ever read the transcripts of the 24/7 feeds. I told her a lot of things that they said and did but I guess unless you see it or read it for yourself it perhaps does't have the same affect. We just don't discuss it at this point. I really think that if she had seen and heard the real Friendship for her self she would not have liked them.
Let's face it..... Unless you see it for yourself they are hard to believe.

[tweety_kiss]

Shae,

I also like the fact how Kaysar and Michael reached out. Here Michael was put in a very hot seat and he left the set very gracefully and set up his website and board and everyone tried to talk to him and off course he got overwhelmed with responses. I wish I had a chance to get to know Michael better.

Kaysar also set a very fine example for his heritage and religion. It got me even more interested in his religion. I know I can now always go there and read. I have also gone to other websites to read about the Muslim religion and I have found it very fascinating.

These two are very fine gentlemen and I can bet their families are very proud of them.

[STella668]

A wise man once told me, during the time I was transitioning from thinking of someone else as my lifemate to thinking of the person as my soon-former-lifemate, "you know, STella, for some people, fighting is the only form of intimacy they can tolerate".

Could be this friend feels you growing away from her, is as clueless as Ivette on how much of it would be under HER control, and wants a big blowup so it'll be "ok" with her that you don't hang with her any more.

And if that resonates, perhaps you would like to borrow the words I used when walking out into the rain from what had been a wonderful relationship, and was no more: "Have a NICE life!"

Hasn't happened, but mine's been much nicer since I accepted, gut-deep, that there are people one simply cannot cut enough slack, and the attempt to do so will only add to my pain.

Hang in there, things always change, and if you keep your eye on your goal, the change is likely to be mostly for the better!

ST*, wearing the teeshirt

[RhyanShae]

Tweety,

I once said somewhere that I found Kaysar and Michael to be people I could step outside and see, relate to, and admire, and not just for their good looks. I'd cbe honored to be considered their friends, and not because of their fame. Because they're good people. They're smart, creative, funny, and overall have the biggest hearts of all.

The fact that Michael did embrace his fans, and then started Kaysar on that route made me understand more and more what was wrong with the other group, and what is wrong, in general, with our society.

It's sad that intelligent, creative, fun, caring, stubborn, but good hearted people are "outcasts" compared to others. I never have seen such an ill-fitting title as that.

[tweety_kiss]

Stella,

I don't mean to sound harsh, but in after much analyzing of her behavior in the recent years, I have come to the conclusion that she is another Maggie. She has not always been like this but something must have snapped in her and changed her to what she is now. I have no clue on that since she will never confide in me but then yet like I stated before I BETTER CONFIDE in her. I mean that is the attitude she has. Off course I don't confide in her and when she calls and emails, it is just small talk now.

The most interesting part of this is when Kaysar wrote about Maggie in the CBS blog, the first person I thought of was this "friend".

"Tweety"

[tweety_kiss]

Originally posted by RhyanShae
Tweety,

I once said somewhere that I found Kaysar and Michael to be people I could step outside and see, relate to, and admire, and not just for their good looks. I'd cbe honored to be considered their friends, and not because of their fame. Because they're good people. They're smart, creative, funny, and overall have the biggest hearts of all.

The fact that Michael did embrace his fans, and then started Kaysar on that route made me understand more and more what was wrong with the other group, and what is wrong, in general, with our society.

It's sad that intelligent, creative, fun, caring, stubborn, but good hearted people are "outcasts" compared to others. I never have seen such an ill-fitting title as that.

This reminds me of a conversation I had with my mother yesterday. We were talking about how certain people mistreat others and then I brought up another girl I went to high school with who is really a very wonderful lady and then my mother said people like her are few and far between. I sadly agreed.

I know if I was ever in the company of Michael and Kaysar, I would be very comfortable and I could talk for hours with them on any subject without conflicts.

[RhyanShae]

I think it would be one of the most intense conversations I'd experienced as well. Not sure how to explain why, exactly. hehe.