Islamic beliefs and Abu Ghraib atrocities

[Lala]

After learning about the Islamic beliefs regarding physical contact between unmarried men and women, I started thinking about the scandal at Abu Ghraib prison in Iraq.

As awful as the photos were at first glance, they are more disturbing in light of the fact that Muslim men are so much more modest than men in America. The photos were depicting psychological and physical torture. This was intentional humiliation of the worst kind.

I know that we have been told that all of these men were enemies of a free Iraq, but it is hard for me to believe that with all the other screw ups that have occurred in Iraq that there weren't a few innocent men who happened to be in the wrong place at the wrong time. I can't bear the thought that an innocent man had to endure that humiliation. Frankly, I don't think we should use torture. Ever.

My apologies to anyone that finds this topic unpleasant - I share your disgust. After reading the responses from the Muslims on this board to the"Illicit Sexual Relations" thread it just hit me like a thunderbolt that what happened in Abu Ghraib was even more horrible in light of Islamic beliefs.

Thanks to everyone for sharing.

[Ladyjinx]

If they had done that in our prisons on death row people woudl of been outraged.
Wrong is wrong and you dont have to beleive in a religion to see that.
Plus is'nt there some thing where we are not supposed to torture prisoners of war?
I've heard things they did and seen some of the pictures ...i could nto look at all of them some things i jsut dont want to see.
I really dont know what to say about it except it was inexcusable, regardless of their religion or race or yes even if they where criminals, it was inexcusable.

[cyounus]

Weither innocent or guilty no human should have to go through that. However much I disagree with the war, I do not believe that those actions would have been condoned by anyone but a small group of people that are not worth my time and energy even in prayer.

[Kay]

Lady,

It's called the Geneva Convention put into effect shortly after WWII.

[Ladyjinx]

Doh ...I knew that. really i did! Just forgot what it was called.
Thank you Kay :}}

[Kay]

LOL!
You're like me! There are moments when I can't think of the name of certain things for anything!
I call it a Senior moment.

[blueeyesdebbie22]

bump

[Lala]

The issue of the Geneva Convention was raised during the hearings on Abu Ghraib, and the conclusion was that the Geneva Convention only applies when war is declared. The U.S. never declared war on Iraq.

I know that this sounds like semantics, but that is how the Geneva Convention was thrown out of the equaiton.

[lavonne]

I don't want to get too political or Big Brother (no pun intended) may come after me.

But, do some homework ladies, and you will find all sorts of nasty things the American government has done since September 11th, 2001. Most Americans prefer to play ostrich and bury their heads in the sand.

Do a google on Brandon Mayfield and Tariq Ramadan...quite a few scary things happening here at home too....Not to mention Guantanamo Bay. Abu Ghraib is just the tip of the iceberg.

http://web.amnesty.org/pages/guantanamobay-index-eng

[cyounus]

the Universal Declaration of Human Rights that was adopted on December 10, 1948 by the General Assembly of the United Nations

Whereas recognition of the inherent dignity and of the equal and inalienable rights of all members of the human family is the foundation of freedom, justice and peace in the world,

Whereas disregard and contempt for human rights have resulted in barbarous acts which have outraged the conscience of mankind, and the advent of a world in which human beings shall enjoy freedom of speech and belief and freedom from fear and want has been proclaimed as the highest aspiration of the common people,

Whereas it is essential, if man is not to be compelled to have recourse, as a last resort, to rebellion against tyranny and oppression, that human rights should be protected by the rule of law,

Whereas it is essential to promote the development of friendly relations between nations,

Whereas the peoples of the United Nations have in the Charter reaffirmed their faith in fundamental human rights, in the dignity and worth of the human person and in the equal rights of men and women and have determined to promote social progress and better standards of life in larger freedom,

Whereas Member States have pledged themselves to achieve, in cooperation with the United Nations, the promotion of universal respect for and observance of human rights and fundamental freedoms,

Whereas a common understanding of these rights and freedoms is of the greatest importance for the full realization of this pledge,

Now, therefore,

The General Assembly,

[cyounus]

The following are Surahs that dictate war


17:33]
You shall not kill any person - for GOD has made life sacred - except in the course of justice. If one is killed unjustly, then we give his heir authority to enforce justice. Thus, he shall not exceed the limits in avenging the murder, he will be helped.

2:191]
You may kill those who wage war against you, and you may evict them whence they evicted you. Oppression is worse than murder…

When the Quran was revealed slavery was in wide practice throughout the Arab World. it would have been impractical and suicidal to place an immediate ban on all slavery. The Quran uses a better psychological approach to win people's hearts i against slavery and all forms of discrimination by placing a strong emphacis on human dignity and equality and encouraging the freeing of slaves


90:10-14
Did we not show him the two paths? He should choose the difficult path. Which one is the difficult path? The freeing of slaves. Feeding, during the time of hardship.

law forbids killing the wounded, torturing the enemy, destroying them by treachery or deception, or using bombs, missiles or weapons which add to their torture. It also prohibits the poisoning of wells, rivers and foods; it recommends that the corpses of the dead be respected, and prohibits any severity or mayhem be inflicted on them, regardless of the nationality of dead people.

76:8-9
They donate their favorite food to the poor, the orphan, and the captive. "We feed you for the sake of GOD; we expect no reward from you, nor thanks.

The purpose of this Law of Protection is to give these people a chance to learn the truth about Islam. In this way, Moslems could effectively spread the message of their faith. The origin of this lies in God's words:

9:6
If one of the idol worshipers sought safe passage with you, you shall grant him safe passage, so that he can hear the word of GOD, then send him back to his place of security. That is because they are people who do not know.


I would like to add that in the Ten Commandments given to the Prophet Moses (pbuh) that the translation is not

"Thou shall not kill", but rather it is "Thou shall not murder".

[Ladyjinx]

Oh no i agree there is a difference between killing to defend and killing just to kill or for financial gain. I really dont support the death penalty for criminals though. My main reason for that though is there are too many times we are wrong and the person sitting there is not guilty.

[cyounus]

I agree with you. Only God knows the truth and what are the consiquence of the people who convected an inicent person

[Ladyjinx]

Well if they killed him.........then they commited murder.

[cyounus]

that's the way I see it.